Obama: "Promise? What Promise?"

So now we're used and trivialized for comedy material,

I liked it better when he was silent.

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by: exfundie @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 12:13:01 PM CDT

n/c

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by: txmichael @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 12:22:26 PM CDT

I saw that story last night

and was stunned. Where's that acclaimed "empathy?"

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by: peacearena @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 12:27:46 PM CDT

My decision...

not to vote for Obama or any other Dem until full LGBT rights are incorporated in the party platform just got stronger.

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by: Bruno @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 12:44:11 PM CDT

tempting but...

That notion is tempting, but the country is in a load of trouble and probably can't survive another administration by the non-reality based party.

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by: kathygnome @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:18:20 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

well they will be back in 4 or 8 years

and I'd honestly rather have my rights before they arrive.

This president was untruthful with us

Sad thing is, despite every sign that he was not necessarily our friend, large parts of our community abandoned true friends like Kucinich to vote to re-affirm God in the mix."

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

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by: MauraHennessey @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:51:16 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Even if "god" is in the mix...

I cannot imagine that any "god" worth worshiping  could be as big an ass as many of his "followers" would make him out to be...

That said, I believe the truth shall set us free, when it is finally spoken.  But I am hearing nothing, now...

Hate stops a beating heart.

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by: KarenS @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 22:12:44 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Even if "god" is in the mix...

I cannot imagine that any "god" worth worshiping  could be as big an ass as many of his "followers" would make him out to be...

That said, I believe the truth shall set us free, when it is finally spoken.  But I am hearing nothing, now...

Hate stops a beating heart.

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by: KarenS @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 22:12:44 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Well, what do we do with a man who speaks like Jesus Christ and behaves like Dick Cheney

except that Cheny is more supportive of our rights.

Listen up President Obama:
Dick Cheney is more a friend to the LGBT community than you are.  Scary thought, isn't it?

Ask yourself what the LGBT community woud do if Dick Cheney got control of the Republican Party?

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

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by: MauraHennessey @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 17:10:40 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I would focus it a bit more

My decision has been not to vote for any politician of any party who is not willing to take a clear, concise and unequivocable position in favor of GLBT rights and then follow up on that position if/when voted into office.

Past support for GLBT issues in the Democratic platform brought us nothing. I was told point-blank at the Washington State Democratic Convention in 1998 (I was a delegate), from the floor of the convention, that the platform is a guideline and not an ultimatum, and that every elected Democrat is free -- nay, is obligated -- to vote in accordance with his or her constituency, even when that consituency is homophobic, Dominionist and thoroughly bigoted. We are not, after all, the Republican Party and we do not demand "ideological purity." I fail to see how firm support for our rights in party platforms will get us anything other than the same shit on a different day.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même merde.

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by: TechBear @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:01:46 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I'm *sorta* doing this

in one case...Gavin Newsom's.  But I just feel overall I'm not trying to make a statement about some of the Democratic Party, but the whole.  And to do that, I have to in essence threaten to remove my support fully until change is accomplished.  It's the only way we as a community can feel that this fight is on our term's, not Obama's and the DNC's.

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by: Bruno @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 18:28:15 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Actions?

He can't even speak up for civil rights for ALL Americans, I expect him to do nothing.

You may not be gay, but you may be next.

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by: LeslieK @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 12:58:09 PM CDT

Send comment to Whitehouse...

Here is mine:

What is this??? The President jokes about his soldiers!!

Joking about demonstrators outside his $30,000 per couple dinner.
"One of them said, "Obama keep your promise,' " the president said. "I thought that's fair. I don't know which promise he was talking about."
President Obama JOKES about Promise to Repeal DADT!...and Marriage Equality.!

Here is HIS AD for his PROMISE to repeal DADT.

youtube.com/watch?v=wP8lj2d_qrM
Obama recommits to repeal "Don't Ask Don't Tell" policy

Or even better, Mr. President- this from Dan Choi, who has more honor right now than you:
youtube.com/watch?v=JIwgB759d9k
LtDanChoiAtObamaProtestBeverlyHilton27May2009

Lt. Dan Choi, a West Point graduate and an Arabic translator, was discharged from the Army when he declared he was gay on national television. His conviction that the military's policy is "a deadly poison" inspired him to lead the protest on Wednesday.
"There is a message that I want to give to Obama," said Choi. "Stop forcing our soldiers to hide. Let them be free to serve."
Undeterred by Tuesday's decision by the California Supreme Court to uphold the ban on gay marriage passed by voters in November, Choi said to the crowd, "We can't wait for somebody else to give us rights.... if we want rights, we have to fight for it. We have to earn it."
Choi ended his speech the same way it began, chanting, "Love is worth it."

Mr. President, I thought your silence disgraceful- but your actual words are far worse, sir.
Hopefully your actual ACTIONS can help you redeem yourself. But right now, I'm not having alot of faith in that.

 

It's the Hammer of JUSTICE,
It's the Bell of FREEDOM,
It's the Song about LOVE between,
my Brothers and my Sisters
...All over this Land.

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by: Orion45 @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:04:02 PM CDT

And Mine

Ha, ha, ha! President Obama is such a card, I think he may have missed his calling. Last night, when confronted by protesters appalled at his complete abandonment of the LGBT community, President Obama mentioned one protester who stated that the President should keep his promises. Obama responded with "which ones"?

Isn't that funny - those stupid faggots actually thought Obama was serious when he promised to be a "fierce advocate" for the LGBT community. They thought he was actually being honest when he said he would fight for the repeal of anti-gay hate laws like DOMA and DADT. They should have known better; Obama has proven he is just another politician - another Clinton, even, willing to throw us fags and dykes under the bus when it is politically difficult to actually support us.

This week the California Supreme Court ruled that the majority (comprising good, straight "Christian" people, of course) can strip the minority (dirty faggots and dykes) of any and all rights, all through a majority vote. As an alleged Constitutional scholar, President Obama must see the danger of such a ruling, but he has chosen to be silent. Apparently civil rights are only important when polling supports them.

During the Democratic primaries and the general election, I was a fierce supporter of President Obama's, even defending his anti-gay actions to other LGBT voters. I gave over $1,700 to the campaign, forgoing my summer vacation to send the money to the Obama campaign instead. That is proving to be the worst investment I've ever made. Sure, I have $38 a month more in my paycheck, but I am still forced to deal with a President who considers me a sub-human, second-class citizen.

I hope the President and his sex partner, Ms. Robinson (I'm sure as hell not going to recognize the "marriage" of a man who refuses to recognize my rights)  enjoy their time in the White House. As it stands now, Mr. Obama is rapidly losing his support among LGBT voters and is going to find our wallets closed and our schedules to busy to help him when he decides to run for re-election.

Disappointment does not being to define what I am feeling right now.

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by: CPT_Doom @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:07:58 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Inspired To Write Myself

And do create an account here to mention it.

Hello Mr. President,

I write in response to your comments made at The Beverly Hilton fund raiser.  You joked about protesters outside saying of the signs, "One of them said, 'Obama keep your promise,' I thought that's fair. I don't know which promise he was talking about."  The audience then reportedly laughed in response.

Mr. President I cannot say that I will not vote for you again as that would be unrealistic given the likely alternative options I will face, but I am very disappointed that you would make the ending of the armed forces' unjust policy on gays and lesbians serving openly into a joke.  

Plutarch quoted Bion of Borysthenes as saying, "Though boys throw stones at frogs in sport, yet the frogs do not die in sport but in earnest."  Words, like stones, have consequences and I find yours ill considered.  Before I heard this I was willing to be patient on the subject of 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' and counseling my activist friends to do the same.  But I feel very wounded by your words and so my forbearance has run out.  

At the time of the presidential campaign I was unemployed and I still donated to your campaign.  Ten dollars is not a lot of money in the grand scheme of things, but at that time it came out of what I would have otherwise spent upon food and tea.  This is why I feel particularly hurt by your inaction and your words.  I feel as though my support is expected because no matter how little you do for gay Americans voting for a Republican would be worse.  Much as with President Clinton and the elder President Bush I now worry that electing you will ultimately be worse for gays than electing someone like John McCain.

I am very disappointed in you and also in myself for believing in you.  I will not make the mistake of believing that you are different than other politicians twice and I fully expect that you will disappoint on a host of other issues such as health care and regulation of banks as well.

Yours,
<real name>

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by: MtSherman @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:43:31 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Great letter

Thanks for sharing it.

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by: exfundie @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:47:06 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

maybe pam can post something on HUFF POST

as they have an article up that states that he addressed and agreed with the protesters....

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

While many Obama supporters waved and cheered as his motorcade approached the Beverly Hilton, some protesters decried Tuesday's California Supreme Court ruling that upheld the voter-approved gay marriage ban. Some of them also urged Obama to repeal the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy for gays.

Obama said he could not hear the protesters' exact words, but he agreed with one who shouted that the president should keep his promises.

The trollish sounding blogger formerly known as BURNSEY

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by: R.K. Wright @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:06:33 PM CDT

You're right Burnsey

they totally misrepresent what he actually said and give him a pass.  Does anybody have a HuffPo connection?

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by: exfundie @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:13:52 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Yes, PAM does.

She is posted there on a semi regular basis, I've seen a number of stories by her on the site.

The trollish sounding blogger formerly known as BURNSEY

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by: R.K. Wright @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:31:47 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The Ohio joke was bad enough.

now this. . .I'm sickened.

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by: ggw59 @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:11:31 PM CDT

Iowa

But yeah, you're right. He's having way too much "fun" making "fun" of our struggle. Mr. President, this is decidedly not funny.

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by: craigkg @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:58:49 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I was there last night

I was wearing my t-shirt with Ghandhi and Martin Luther King Jr. with the words below it "BE THE CHANGE".  I am the one with the red sign "I DO ..."

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_GY69...

I am really losing "hope" on Obama. And of the so-called "Liberal Hollywood" attendees, only 2, yup, TWO parties waved back at us. Disappointing.

Obama's "acknowledgement" was actually disrespectful.  And to think that our group was so respectful. If Obama continues with his "I don't know which promise" bs, he will lose our support fast. And respect.

Does he know how once you cross gays you will regret it forever?

More video here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...

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by: Juan @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:16:50 PM CDT

I'd take it one further

Those who stayed to eat their meals and donate money deserve none of MY money or support!

Has anyone seen a complete list of attendees to start a boycott?

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

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by: Louise @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:22:07 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Where is the next fundraiser?

We need to be at every one of his funraisers to remind him we are not going away. Better yet like the suffragettes we need to stand in protest every day at the White House until he acknowledges us.  

Come, come, my conservative friend, wipe the dew off your spectacles, and see that the world is moving."
-Elizabeth Cady Stanton

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by: T2inDC @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:36:43 PM CDT

Dan Choi was fired

because he chose to break the law. That was his decision, but he did break the law. If a soldier cannot abide by the laws underwhihc he/she agreed to serve, then they should not sign up. Its really as simple as that.

He's free to advocate whatever he wants now...that seems fair.

As for Obama, I want him working on health care and the economy before he comes anywhere near this stuff. Some of us just don't have the luxury of abandoning life sustaining social services for policies that benefit an elite few.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 13:53:00 PM CDT

Rosa Parks was jailed

because she chose to break the law.

Dan Choi, like Rosa Parks, was practicing a form of civil disobedience to protest an unjust law.

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by: kevinchi @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:00:48 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

An Essential Conflict

More importantly, DADT creates an essential, and impossible to reconcile, conflict with other military policies and laws requiring honesty. Complying with DADT requires not complying with other requirements. Either way the LGBT service members are stuck.

As for the "elite few" - do only rich people get married? Should essential human rights be ignored because it is politically expedient? Pretty sad commentary on what was once a great country.  

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by: CPT_Doom @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:10:49 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Precisely...

...He chose to intentionally enter an industry that he knew at the outset, did not permit him to be out. That's a choice. Civil disobedience is a choice. Both have consequences. Dan Choi's dismissal from the armed forces, though unfortunate, was a choice that HE MADE. To me that makes this a less than urgent issue. Certainly less than the million of people in need of health care or who are losing their jobs for no reason other than the economy is in the crapper.

Dan Choi chose to make himself unemployed. There are people serving right now that are doing so because they actually CAN follow the established rules.

At a time when millions of others are losing jobs because of reasons beyond their control, its hard to feel sorry for someone that made the choice willingly (besides, I doubt he's unemploy or going without income).

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by: SciFi Geek @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:58:35 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The logic here is remarkable

Lemme ask- what would YOUR reaction be if over 3 million American jobs were legally out of your reach due to YOUR sexuality?

I'd be p*ssed as hell and suing to my last nickel regarding my country's discriminatory practices, not saying "Oh well".

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

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by: Louise @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:32:51 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Actually...

They were not out of his reach. He simply had to follow the rules. Or are you suggesting that he is the only LGB person serving the armed forces?

They became out of his reach the moment he went on television and announced to the world that he was gay. As I understand it, up until that point, he had flourishing career.

Again, that was his choice. If his dating/love life is more important to him than his career, so be it.

As I said, while its unfortunate that the law is in place, that is still the law. He made the choice to violate that law and paid the price. Given the number of people out of work for reasons beyond their control, its hard to get aggitated about a person who intentionally made themself unemployed to make a political statement.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:25:12 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

"If his dating/love life is more important to him than his career, so be it"

Do you seriously not understand that being gay is his identity, his being, not just his love life?

---

by: exfundie @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:50:25 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

He simply had...

...to break the ethical code of the jobs which he would be holding by lying extensively about his personal life.  Great "choice" there -- "Our jobs are available to LGBT people -- as long as we get to keep them in the double-bind of firing them if they're honest and being able to claim violation of our ethical policies if they lie".

It seems like you place far too much ethical weight on "the law" and far too little on...well, ethics.

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by: M @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:55:37 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Wow, I am appalled at your callous remarks as well...

...he did break the law, but you fail to acknowledge that the law is essentially unfair, asking of homosexual service members something it does not ask of heterosexuals.  If you would read the policy (something I feel most people do not do), it is asking gay service members to lie and jump through hoops so that their fellow service don't even suspect that they are gay.  Perhaps you are not gay and you do not realize how difficult doing something like that is, but I am sure you can imagine how infused your family life is in everything you do.  Imagine trying to get through your day to day life without mentioning your wife/husband/children, etc.  I'm certain you could not.

You seem to want sympathy for those who are out of work (I am soon to be joining those ranks -- hopefully for only a short time), but yet don't see that while the unemployment problem affects all manner of people indiscriminately, the military's policy specifically targets a minority population.

You also seem to miss the big point of civil disobedience.  Choi does not care about his own job.  His fight is not to restore justice to himself, but to sacrifice his job in order to bring light to a problem affecting a minority population.  It is the exact thing that Rosa Parks did.  Her goal was not to sit at the front of the bus, it was to get arrested in order to highlight the injustice of being forced to sit at the back to those who would be allies.

"To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best day and night to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle which any human being can fight and never stop fighting." -E.E. Cummings

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by: popsiclestand @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 22:10:27 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Further...

...might I add, laws are created in this country to serve the people, not the other way around.

There is no valid reason to discharge someone from military service based on their sexual orientation, particularly an exemplary officer, beyond protecting SOME people's (many of whom are not even serving) fear of the "other".  If we are going to start making laws in service of the fear of something different, we should start with bringing segregation back.  I know that there would be more than enough supporters in my home state of South Carolina.

"To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing its best day and night to make you like everybody else means to fight the hardest battle which any human being can fight and never stop fighting." -E.E. Cummings

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by: popsiclestand @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 22:53:41 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

ENDA, DOMA, and DADT are Economic Issues

When GLBT people can be denied employment, housing, and public accomodations in much of the country simply for who we are, lack of recourse for discrimination is an economic issue.  When same sex couples and their children are forced to incur legal fees for documents that can still be challenged, pay higher taxes, and forego all of the other benfits of marriage, those are economic issues.  When our nation discharges trained soldiers, forces honorable people to lie, and closes a major career path to GLBT people who do want to serve in the military, those are economic issues.  

It is myopic to focus so much creating a rising tide that you forget about people who can be thrown overboard at will.

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by: freestyle @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 10:03:11 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

elite few???

what kind of ally would call a whole community from a wide background of people "an elite few?" I'm sorry but I highly doubt you're an ally in this fight for civil equality in all forms within this country.

"I am the sledgehammer to your 10,000 mirrors." everyone needs to be open and out of their closets.

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by: TSinGarnNC16 @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:16:10 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Actually...

I'm not an "ally." I'm a gay black male. However, I'm an advocate for the poor and working people of this nation. The issue is that I do not feel that the President should waste one iota of political capital on this if it in any way undermines the other aspects of his social agenda. Thos critical issues, are life and death issues.

These LGBT issues that are getting the most publicity are comparatively inconviences that impact a select few. The Matthew Sheppard Act and ENDA, yes those are important issues that need to be dealt with now (sooner rather than later because they are life and death issues). These other issues are by comparison luxuries that are nowhere near as critical.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:04:31 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

How about poor and working people

who are gay who might opt to go into the armed forces simply to get training, education, and a way out of their circumstances (and I know a few gay youth like this)?

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by: kevinchi @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:30:48 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

**raises hand**

It was either military service or be exiled to Brigham Young University or not go to college.

Personally, I'm glad I made the choice I did, and served my country, got an education, and became a productive member of society instead of a self-loathing christian closet case hell-bent on proving my hetero-ness and doing what my fmaily expected of me.

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi

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by: Keori @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:42:48 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

However...

You did go and serve. You were not denied the opportunity right out of the gate.  

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by: SciFi Geek @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:33:02 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I did indeed go and serve

And I was blackmailed and raped by a fellow service member when he stumbled upon my secret. I wasn't asked, I didn't tell, but I sure as fuck was made to suffer for obeying the rules.

Don't ever preach to me about DADT not being a "real" issue. It's a goddam human tragedy. I would really appreciate if you would STFU about it now, because unless you've put yourself on the line in such a fashion, you have nothing of worth to contribute to the discussion.

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi

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by: Keori @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:50:51 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Thank you for your service Keori

I can only imagine the stress of serving in the military and having to remain closeted.  Having grown up in a fundamentalist family myself and having attended fundamentalist schools, I know what it is like to have to hide who you are.  It is damaging to your soul and an unhealthy way to live, at the very least.  Every day we are asking LGB soldiers to live with this burden.  It's not fair and is psychologically damaging.

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by: exfundie @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 17:11:23 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

That's my girl.

I have often said that my 2 best friends of over 30 and 25 years are the sisters Life gave me- Keori is the extra daughter Life gave me as well.

And w/o having to change diapers- a big plus! ;)  

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

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by: Louise @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 17:41:26 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Thank you Keori for your service.

I salute people like you for your love of your country and the service you have given to us.  Gracias!

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by: Juan @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 20:36:30 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

They...

can still join the military under the condition that they cannot be out. The military has all sorts of arcane rules that they make soldiers follow. If you want to work in the military you have to abide by their rules.

No one is really being denied jobs per se. They simply have to keep their love life private and quiet. That should be no big deal if you are doing work you love.

Look, I'm certainly not in support of DADT, but I also don't think that it is the national crisis that some want to pretend that it is. There are other things more important. People who can't keep their love life private will just have to find another line of work until the law is changed.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:30:21 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

You say all that

given the few available options for employment and training in an economy like this. How many "lines of work" are avaiable to, say, a 19 year old black gay kid nowadays? Don't you know anything about the youth unemployment numbers, especially for minority youth?

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by: kevinchi @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:34:40 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I don't consider marriage to be a luxury.

   It's a BASIC HUMAN RIGHT. whether you agree with that or not, it is. poor straight people can get married and acquire benefits, so why not poor gay people? what about sick gay people as well? are they not allowed to share their benefits that their partners might be receiving? This has nothing to do with poverty. Anyone at any financial level can get married, with exception of literally being pennyless.

  Of course Dan Choi did it to prove his point but when you look at it, Dan Choi actually followed a military code to be honest but the DADT policy kicked him out. He followed his heart to be honest, which is a hell of a lot more that I can say for Choi than I can say for Obama, who has LIED. In honesty, I don't trust Obama on these issues because he doesn't really deserve to "head" them if he doesn't even think we're equal. Making jokes about our civil rights is a complete lie to what he campaigned on. I almost wish i had never campaigned for his sorry butt because I trusted him more than that fundamentalist nutcase, Palin and her side kick mclame. At least it's easier to fight an out in the open bigot, rather than someone who himself, hides in a closet to keep the fundies from attacking him/her.

  The whole argument that he needs to save his political capital is the biggest crock of shit I've ever seen. That's a direct slap to the face. I've seen that argument all over huffingtonpost on topics related to Prop h8. It's sad when your neighbor thinks you will never be equal to him/her. You make one really weak argument. Marriage provides over 1000 legal rights to the couples who have that binary contract. they, in effect have more rights than those who aren't allowed to marry. That is why it is a social issue that you should be supporting. Most of all, marriage brings happiness, so why let LGBT people suffer?

"I am the sledgehammer to your 10,000 mirrors." everyone needs to be open and out of their closets.

---

by: TSinGarnNC16 @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:54:22 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Well

since you are an advocate for the poor I'd suggest you contact the Catholic and Mormon church and tell them to use their financial capital for the poor and working people of this nation.  

Come, come, my conservative friend, wipe the dew off your spectacles, and see that the world is moving."
-Elizabeth Cady Stanton

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by: T2inDC @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 19:07:08 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

SfiFi Geek is no more an advocate for working people than Obama or Bush

both of whom signed on to trillions in bailouts for the looter class and then turn around and demand takebacks and austerity from workers and unions.

You're not an advocate for change, you're an Obamabot, a liberal and a - shudder - Democrat.

You cannot be for working people and for Obama. He and his party pander to the looter rich as much as they pander to christer bigots. Obama and the people who own and support the Democrat party will do anything to get and keep the support of bigots and the looting class.

SfiFi Geeks statement that DADT (part of Clintons bigoted legacy) is a 'law' demonstrates the shameful submission of Obots to the party line bigotry of Obama and the Democrats. DADT is not just a law. It's the codification (by Clinton) of military bigotry. Not mentioning that to save face for your fearless leader Obama is Obotism at its sleaziest.

With Democrats like these who needs Republicans.

The looter rich much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons - they're greedier, they fool more people and they're able to get away with a lot more than Republicans.  

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by: donal1944 @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 21:00:30 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

With all do respect...

You don't know who I am or what I do.

Unlike some people, I actually respect the law. Far more often that you could ever believe, its the basic respect for the rule of law that keeps ALL of us safe. This is even more true of double miniorities like myself. The moment that government officials get it in their head that their "personal convictions" are more important that following the law is the moment we start to have serious problems. You would think that Bush and Cheney would have been illustrative of that very fact.

You may believe that government officials should bend the law when they see fit...I however do not. Independent citizens should be free to conduct civil disobedience. Government officials should have no such luxury. The moment you declare that a politician's "moral outrage" trumps the law is the moment you open the door to all kinds of actions. You may love them when they take an action that you agree with, but you'll be bitterly sorry when they do it with actions you oppose.

---

by: SciFi Geek @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 09:35:10 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Bailouts for GM to make cars in China

is a life or death issue?

The man is more hostile to us than Cheney is, and is just as guilty of international law violations.

Don't ask me to put anything on the backburner; we have waited long enough.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

---

by: MauraHennessey @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 21:41:42 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Obama specifically promised

to change this law- and has done NOTHING.

I'd say that is far worse than what Dan Choi has done...

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

---

by: Louise @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:23:35 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

When sodomy laws were on the books

was it okay then to charge/arrest gay people and not push to repeal the law because there were other issues that should have been addressed first?  President Obama can multi-task (as any president should) and besides, will he really be able to "fix" healthcare and the economy?  I have my doubts.

---

by: exfundie @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:29:12 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

As far as this "elite few" comment

I have to call out this form of homobigotry and scapegoating that frequently comes from the far left; the idea that gay people somehow represent this elite caste of people that only leech and drain resources from the working class and the poor.

 

---

by: kevinchi @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:38:26 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

homobigotry?

Thaat's your term. I call it pragmatism and working to help the most people on the most crutial issues first. By comaprison, the SSM and DADT look like smaller problems. I do not want the president wasting political capital on issues that really do only impact a small population of people. Remember, not all LGBT folks are chomping at the bit to get married or serve in the military. There are alot of us for whom this is not even one of the top 10 issues that the nation needs to address.

Anyone who talks about draining resources is a fool. But there is the potential that the activists will hurt the rest of us on the larger issues by forcing the president to fight these battles now rather than later. Is it a drain on resources, not specifically. But it is a HUGE drain on political capital and goodwill with the American people.

---

by: SciFi Geek @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:29:29 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

it's always pragmatic

to scapegoat gay people. And how is it a drain of political capital when close to 75% of Americans support DADT repeal? Seems as if the 25% that wants the policy to stay in place are the "elite few."

---

by: kevinchi @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:33:13 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

...and those 25%

generally aren't potential Obama voters anyway, so I'm not quite sure what he's trying to do here.

---

by: M @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:58:02 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Sorry

Sorry, but that's a recipe for never accomplishing anything.  For the political staff in the White House there will always be more important issues than GLBT rights, and there will never be a good time to waste political capital on GLBT rights.  And the Dems will figure they have nothing to lose by back-burnering all of our issues, because we'll keep voting for them and sending them money in any event.

One thing the White House could do right now is set a fire under the bureaucrats in HHS or DHS to issue regulations implementing the repeal of the Helms Amendment (HIV+ immigration).  This repeal was approved by Congress last year and signed by George Fucking Bush, and yet HIV+ people still are turned back at the border.

---

by: donkensler @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 18:07:15 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

More

And if he were to give an answer like "Hey we're working on it", I'd feel a lot better than I do being the punch line to a joke.

---

by: donkensler @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 18:11:50 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The President is squandering political capital

with indefinite detentions amd military commission trials.

He is squandering capital by bailing out GM and leaving in place their plan to build cars in China, when we desparately need export dollars.

He is squandering political capital by leaving us in a healthcare quagmire.

He is squandering political capital by recklessly relocating troops in Iraq that there were no accomodations for

He is squandering political capital in Afghanistan.

Obama is good at squandering political capital.
As good as Bush was at squandering Capital.

It is no good trying to be an apologist for a man who talks like Christ the Lord and behaves like Dick Cheney, except that Cheney is more favourable towards LGBT's

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

---

by: MauraHennessey @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 21:47:38 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Kevin your political dyslexia is getting worse...

SciFi Geek is not far left, he's right centrist, like Obama.  

He voted for Obama and thinks Obama is doing a good job except for that 'gay thing'. He's an Obot who'll tell lie, make excuses and wink at Obama's bigotry at the drop of a hat. SciFi Geek wants to excise everything form our agenda thats polictially uncomfortable for Obama. DADT. SSM. You name it; if Obama's not for it SciFi Geek dismisses it as trifling.    

His claim to be an advocate for working and poor people is a lie. Just as everything his fearless leader says about being a fierce defender, and withdrawing the troops and being pro worker and pro-union is a lie.

With Democrats like these who needs Republicans.

"I have to call out this form of homobigotry and scapegoating that frequently comes from the far left"

Prove it. Give us some citations and links from this century, not a hundred and fifty years ago.  


The looter rich much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons - they're greedier, they fool more people and they're able to get away with a lot more than Republicans.  

---

by: donal1944 @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 21:17:22 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

donal, don't EVER call me politically dyslexic again BUT!

As far as modern socialim (post 1950) you may be right. I need to do my research.

I did find some stuff on the CPUSA not allowing gays (why Harry Mattachine left) and there are stories of it (such as your own, I had to get that in) but by and large you are right, socialism tends to be on the side of gay rights nowadays. Good takedown. (bows)

---

by: kevinchi @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 21:58:19 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I am not now and never have been a member

of the CPUSA. They're far too right wing for me. They're so right wing that when they decided to merge/disappear into the 'liberal-progressive' wing of the Democrat party about 60 years ago no one even noticed.

You might want to center your research on the Maoists. Even the CP is nominally pro equality. Of course the real focus of research on homobigotry should begin and ends with the White House, Congress and the christer and islamic cults. Compared to them a few dozen Maoists with a mimeographed 'newspaper' are like a spit in the ocean. They're a non-issue.

As for my I own experience it was a no brainer for me to quit the party I was in. If they lacked the smarts to embrace movements like the fight for LGBT equality and couldn't understand the profoundly revolutionary nature of our struggle then fuck 'em. Plus at the time everyone I knew seemed to be in and out of hospitals and dying so it wasn't as if I had nothing to do with my time.

The looter rich much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons - they're greedier, they fool more people and they're able to get away with a lot more than Republicans.  

---

by: donal1944 @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 00:08:01 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

And some of us.....

would like a job, something that would be much easier with an inclusive ENDA. Obama, a "fierce advocate"? I need to throw up.

---

by: CarbonGirl @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:30:44 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Umm...

Congress has already pledged to pass ENDA and the Mat Shepperd Act this year. I would definately say that that is a critical issue. Its also one that is being addressed.

---

by: SciFi Geek @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:36:23 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Seeing is believing

and we will see.
If congress does, it will without doubt be without any effort by our "God in the mix" leadership of the executive branch of a secular republic.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

---

by: MauraHennessey @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 21:52:41 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

My wife was discharged under DADT

and she never made a peep to the Air Force.  All it takes is one asshole who wants to go find information about your personal life and then out you.  You don't have to break any laws to lose your livelihood under this horrible, disgraceful, nation-endangering policy.  How dare you disrespect and insult the soldiers out there staring death in the face for you?  The least you can do in return is support their right to serve equally!  "Some of us don't have the luxury" of waiting around at the back of the bus for the civil rights that determine the course of our lives, and some of those people are people you owe a great deal to.

Yes we can!

---

by: bluegirlbb @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 18:08:59 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Thank you, bluegirlbb

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi

---

by: Keori @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 18:45:39 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Correction please

Louise, one quick correction to make. Dan Choi is a 1LT, not a Lt.Col. Victor Fehrenbach is a Lt.Col. (which is the Air Force abbreviation; the Army abbreviation for the rank of Lieutenant Colonel is LTC).

In my last post, I mentioned the "Obama administration's utter contempt for its gay and lesbian troops." Democritus told me That's bull and someday you will be ashamed of yourself for saying that. You're almost as bad as the cranks on RedState or WorldNutDaily.

Still think it's bull, Democritus? Obama's gone from silence to turning our very lives into jokes at political fundraising dinners, both last night and at the White House Correspondents' dinner. That's not just contempt, that's pandering to the lowest common denominator. We've gone beyond the typical Dem attitude of "Gee, I wish they'd go away" to the Administration unequivocally showing us the door.

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi

---

by: Keori @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:02:03 PM CDT

Done

and linked your previous and excellent diary as well...

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

---

by: Louise @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:32:04 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

ACK!!

Mom, it's 1LT. ALL CAPS and no punctuation. 1Lt. is an Air Force rank abbreviation!!

http://jade.theostrohafamily.c...

Here, for all future reference posts when we're talking about miltary people, now we can get the correct rank abbreviation for the service.

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi

---

by: Keori @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:46:48 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Done- again...

Don't you have homework to do or something? ;)


"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

---

by: Louise @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:58:53 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

**grumbles**

Fine, fine, I'll get back to saving the world now...sheesh...kid tries to be helpful, see how far it gets her...

/runs back for quick hug and kiss before returning to work

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi

---

by: Keori @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:08:30 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Love you too

As I said, all of my kids nag... ;)

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

---

by: Louise @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:36:51 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

just imagine

if he had made that remark about the protesters at his Commencement address at Notre Dame.  Why do we have to seek common ground on abortion but he can continually shove us under the bus?

---

by: sdv @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:07:10 PM CDT

The Power Behind the Throne

I'm beginning to think we may be shouting out to the wrong person.  It's Rahm Emanuel who decides what the administration's agenda is.

---

by: Jon Michaels @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:18:01 PM CDT

agree

I don't know if it's Emanuel, but I've felt like there was some kind of disagreement within the administration (and campaign and inauguration cmmt) about gay rights. The inauguration debacle, the glbt agenda disappearing and reappearing on websites. Something is going on.

---

by: kathygnome @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:54:39 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Or perhaps Joshua Dubois and friends?

---

by: exfundie @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:57:59 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I wonder how many gays and lesbians in the audience laughed and went right back to eating their tenderloin?

---

by: Zeke @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:45:23 PM CDT

Or the ones

who claim to support, yet kept on noshing?

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

---

by: Louise @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:00:24 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Lt Choi

I am so glad that you shared this video of Lt Choi speaking the at the rally. In my eyes he is a true hero for standing up for what he believes in and to help end the horrible DADT policy.  

I had the honor of interviewing Daniel Choi for my podcast and he went in such great detail about his life and the challenges that he has faced and how he is determined to continue this fight.

All of us who are in the GLBT community and allies need to be strong right now and to not let what happened with Prop 8 to allow us to give up but to continue to fight for our rights and not allow anyone to treat us like second class citizens ever again!

---

by: rambleredhead @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 14:57:59 PM CDT

I was there

last night at the protest in Beverly Hills. I brought along a couple of Hope placards that were used in his campaign but were altered to read "FAIL" and "FRAUD." I thought they may have been a bit harsh, but after his comments, I wish I had made them bigger.
There are no words to describe how much I despise that man. I feel so duped and will be resigning my membership in the Democratic party. Fuck you Obama!

---

by: bwl @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:37:56 PM CDT

I think I saw your sign!

Cool!  Would have been nice to meet you!

My photo is up in my other entry.  ;-)

---

by: Juan @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 20:41:45 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Jokes at our expense

even jokes suavely spun by a self declared "constitutional scholar" are simply high gloss homophobia.

He had to know who the protestors were.

We are not just overlooked, now we are treated with disdain.

Just another case of O-mophobia

Mr President, You promised and then you sold us out for thirty pieces of silver. And like Peter, you now "know us not," haveing denied us at least three times over the past few months.

I hate to say it, Sir, but you are proving to be cunningly deceitful and untrustworthy,

Perhaps Mr Limbaugh and company had some things right about your character.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

---

by: MauraHennessey @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:41:01 PM CDT

people need to stop acting like this is the most important issue out there.

Did anyone think Obama would go out of character and make a declarative statement on gay marriage while going to a fundraiser?  

I am finding it interesting and a bit sad that the community is obsessing on gay marriage when there are basic protections that LGBTs do not have.

The last time I checked a Gallup poll, there is wider support for employment protection, ending Don't Ask Don't Tell, gay adoption, and giving inheritance rights and job benefits to domestic partners than there is for gay marriage.

Why does it seem like people are kicking all these issues to the curb?    

Be better, not bitter!

---

by: Anthony in Nashville @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 15:55:59 PM CDT

We're not

and their is plenty of rage on this issues as well. Obama is throwing down as many anchors as he can on all of our issues. He hasn't advanced a single one of them. But the marriage decision came down this week and that's why it is taking the headlines for now. We just need to keep the pressure on because the hate crimes act is still pending in the Senate after House passage of the act (though I'd like to see the Senate pass Sen. Kennedy's version over the House version). ENDA, MREA and the UAFA still haven't even had hearings on Capitol hill. We still don't have a bill filed to repeal DOMA (or apparently a member of Congress with courage enough to file such a bill).

---

by: craigkg @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:06:30 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

But I think this post and this thread in particular

IS more about Don't Ask Don't Tell and not marriage equality. Dan Choi did speak at this rally yesterday.

Choi's comments above don't speak about particular rights.  

---

by: kevinchi @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:10:01 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

you get a point there, Kevin. *dap*

I think I need to log off for a bit because I'm seeing everything as going through the Gay Marriage Lens.


Be better, not bitter!

---

by: Anthony in Nashville @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:19:12 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

It's about EQUALITY

Marriage equality.  Military Service equality.  Work protection equality.

EQUALITY

Period.

---

by: Juan @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 16:29:04 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Promises? He really didn't make any!

He's only ever said what he believed, not what he'd do.

With regard to DADT, I asked the campaign b4 the election what he DID for equality during 4 years in the Senate: NOTHING.  I asked widely why I should believe that he'd do more if he was promoted to the Whitehouse?  If I was ever give a response, it was more platitudes.

Now, that he's in the Whitehouse, it's the job of the congress: sweet since he's not there anymore.

Hate to say I told you so, but I kept getting shouted down when I whould have the balls to question his commitment to the LGBT community.  I kept asking if he hasn't done anything in the past 4 years, why can I expect anything different?

Just my 2 cents,
Mickey

---

by: queervortex @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 17:17:24 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I am hardly focused upon marriage.

I am angry about a multitude of issues:
His moving troops out fo the Iraqi cities before preparations were completed, resulting in soldiers being placed out in the desert without defences where they have been attacked,

His continuing the military tribunals, in violation of a USSC decision in 1867 stating that the civilian courts had to be used if they were in operation.

His intention to continue indefinite detentions without trial on the grounds that the evidence against the suspects is poisoned by torture. A shame that, but consequently the people get to go free under law.

His wholesale abandoment of the persual of any of our rights.

His expansion of the war in Afghanistan with poorly attainable and poorly defined goals.

He is by and large continuing all of the last policies of the Bush administration. If we have to have the same policies, we ought to at least have Dick Cheney as opposed to President Obama; Cheney supported our rights and did so publically.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

---

by: MauraHennessey @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 17:31:48 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Inauguration Day

President Bait, meet President Switch.

---

by: BCCanuck @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 19:17:42 PM CDT

Not sure he was joking about Prop 8.

It was an insensitive statement, but I could imagine that with the war and Prop 8 protesters converging outside the event (as I think I read in the LA Times article, or if not there on SFGate.com) one could make a dumb joke about not being sure which group was yelling at him--those wanting troops back from Iraq or those of us who are still second-class citizens.  

---

by: chiefscribe @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 19:24:04 PM CDT

Did he really mock the protestors?

I am NOT defending President Obama's silence on lgbt issues, but this article gives a different view of what happened - http://www.dailykos.com/storyo...

---

by: Alvin McEwen @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 20:00:52 PM CDT

It said in the article that he had back-to-back fundraisers

Is it possible that he gave 2 speeches?  I've seen several videos- in the one where he's addressing the celebs he's not behind a podium but moving around the stage.  In the video you reference, he is very serious and standing behind the podium.  

---

by: exfundie @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 22:23:08 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

We're all paying the price for those who voted for Obama.

GLBT folks who voted for Obama, Clinton or McCain voted against themselves and for a right centrist, christian bigot.

Antiwar folks who voted for Obama, Clinton or McCain voted for more mass murder by the US in Iraq and Afghanistan and for US sponsored zionist apartheid and ethnic cleaning against Palestinians. They voted for rendition and against the Bill of Rights. They voted for kidnapping and torture and for extending the Paytriot Act.

People who voted for Obama or McCain voted for lap dogs of the looter rich who pass out trillions to pay of the bad debt of the looting class but demand austerity from unions and workers.

People who voted for Obama, Clinton or McCain made a mistake.

It doesn't matter now if their mistake was naïveté, political drunkeness or simply not seeing an alternative. They can avoid repeating it next time and join in building mass action movements for equality, against war, and for economic democracy. On the other hand people who continue to shill for the Democrats or Republicans or for Obama are writing themselves out of the movement.
 

The looter rich much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons - they're greedier, they fool more people and they're able to get away with a lot more than Republicans.  

---

by: donal1944 @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 20:25:05 PM CDT

Alternatives

I did not see any alternative to Obama at the time and I still do not in retrospect.  I'm reasonably well informed and I do not know of any third party or other Democratic candidates that I would have preferred over Obama.  Who would you have suggested to us?

Mt

---

by: MtSherman @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 00:18:35 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Donal writes in Gus Hall's name every four years. :)

---

by: Pollyanna @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 03:18:28 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Vote? What Vote?

The looter rich much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons - they're greedier, they fool more people and they're able to get away with a lot more than Republicans.  

---

by: donal1944 @ Thu May 28, 2009 at 21:19:46 PM CDT

This has roused me to finally call the White House,

my 2 CA Senators and Representative about my disappointment with the President and the Democrats.  It's really demoralizing to see Obama become just One More Commander in Chief Who Didn't Serve trying to entertain a bunch of Hollywood donors (at $30,000 a pop!) by mocking and insulting soldiers under his command like Lt. Dan Choi.  

---

by: williamsf @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 00:33:01 AM CDT

Joe.My.God has video of the President

to put what he (the President)said into some context...

Thx again to k r.

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

---

by: Louise @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 06:49:11 AM CDT

Here

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

---

by: Louise @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 07:54:06 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

You need to watch the video of Obama at the fundraiser

He's not dissing anybody. He's not being smug. He's not attacking anybody. He's not actually really making a joke. He's ACTUALLY saying people have a right to hold him to his promises.

This tantrum over his remarks is embarrassing.

--ish

---

by: ish @ Fri May 29, 2009 at 07:16:25 AM CDT