WaPo: Obama's HRC speech will focus on 'incremental advancements as evidence of progress'

are we there yet?

We couldn't possibly characterize "incremental advancements" as "all deliberate speed", could we?

No matter how healthy a man's morals may be when he enters the White House, he comes out again with a pot-marked soul.
-- Mark Twain

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by: coram nobis @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:12:28 AM CDT

HRC = Incrementalism

This sounds about right for an HRC dinner. Let us not forget that HRC themselves continue to endorse pro-war, anti-choice, anti-immigrant, anti-labor and Republican candidates over more progressive challengers.  

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by: queertodaydotcom @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:13:58 AM CDT

Ugggh

This incremental bullshit annoys the crap out of me. Candidate Obama was all for civil rights, now that he's President it's like he's backpedaling on all of it.

I hope he enjoys his one term because if he doesn't grow a set that's exactly what he's going to get, a single term.  

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by: truthspew @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:17:55 AM CDT

On Facebook I posted

I have to go out and get the electron microscope (to see the incremental progress).  

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by: Pam Spaulding @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:23:19 AM CDT

Save your money

A cheap magnifying glass will tell you the same thing!

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by: Phil @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:27:49 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

More unnecessary hyperbole

C'mon. This is a cheap shot. Incremental progress is EXACTLY what has been happening for us as a community over the last extended period, and it's a good thing. Take a look at the climate of congress. Take a look at the wingnuts and teabaggers. Take a look at the strong and steady advancements in marriage equality--and also the strong rebuff to marriage equality delivered in California and threatened in many other states.

This is the real world. Compare where we are now to where we were and the answer is better off. All this frustration at Obama not suddenly turning the world on its head and advancing every item on our agenda is understandable but it's also a fantasy. That's not how the world works.

Expecting that in nine months Obama would have been able to revolutionize gay civil rights is some kind of weird alternate reality. On the other hand, incrementally, we're on track for hate crimes, for ENDA. We're on track for elimination of DADT, and challenges to DOMA are in the works. Obama is part of this. This sudden speech to HRC is again evidence that he takes us seriously.

If you're really saying that you think Obama is a homophobe or that he's telling us to be happy with crumbs, you might as well be arguing that he's a muslim born in Kenya.  

--ish

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by: ish @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 06:13:10 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Missing the point

On the other hand, incrementally, we're on track for hate crimes, for ENDA.

I've been as critical as anyone of those who began whining fifteen minutes after his inauguration speech was over that he hadn't already repealed DADT and DOMA, cured AIDS and the common cold, executed Perez Hilton, etc.  

But do you get the significance of the word "incremental," particularly when it comes to trans-inclusion? The term "incremental progress" is code for transphobia legitimization in the same sense that "state's rights" has long been the socially acceptable way to say that one supports government-enforced racism.

A hint to whatever overpaid, non-trans HRC flack is writing Obama's speech: We have our decoder rings, and we know that 'incrementalism' does not translate to 'ovaltine.'

>^..^<

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by: KatRose @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 06:46:38 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

The blurbs about this

all speak to it, and its the sort of term that is extremely, um...

oh, what the hell: weaponized

when it comes to the trans community.  Anyone who thinks the rage is merely overreaction truly has no clue of just how bad things are within the trans community as a whole.

And if the policy wonks behind this were even vaguely aware of that (its fairly obvious that CNN hasn't been of late), they'd be shying away from that word with all the effort they could muster.

This is not hyperbole:

If incrementalism is used, in pretty much any way, expect something akin to the anger voiced in '06 and early '07.  And absolutely expect any sort of reasonable watchfulness of the HRC to vanish.

Seriously -- expect active anti-HRC stuff of the sort no one has seen fully yet.

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...

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by: dyssonance @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 07:46:00 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Don't worry

If incrementalism is used, in pretty much any way, expect something akin to the anger voiced in '06 and early '07.  And absolutely expect any sort of reasonable watchfulness of the HRC to vanish.

I'm sure that the HRC press releases woleheartedly supporting whatever Obama might say have already been written.

>^..^<

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by: KatRose @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 10:06:32 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Did I miss the part

of Obama's repeated and broadcast 2008 campaign promises, where he stated emphatically his fierce support for incremental progress?

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

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by: Louise @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 06:58:55 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

words and action

C'mon Louise.

Talk is cheap. I mean that in a good way. Heroic speeches and saying the right thing are really really important.

Translating them to action is much more complex. You have to keep saying those right things over and over again, while recognizing that translating these actions into physical progress is not so easily done: all of this is exactly what Obama is doing.

Perhaps you live in a different country than I do where the Senate is still at least 50% rightwing assholes? Progress will be incremental in this, our real world.  

--ish

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by: ish @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 10:46:02 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Explain, please

Expecting that in nine months Obama would have been able to revolutionize gay civil rights is some kind of weird alternate reality.

Then, can you offer a viable explanation why he made all those promises to us during the campaign?  Is he living in a "weird alternate reality" too?  Or is he just a double-dealing political hack?

You're engaging in your usual Obamabot hyperbole.  No one expected him to "revolutionize gay civil rights" overnight.  But a lot of us thought he'd at least do something.  Anything.  As he promised.

I am not interested in picking up crumbs of compassion thrown from the table of someone who considers himself my master. I want the full menu of rights.  -Archbishop Desmond Tutu

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by: QScribe @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 11:12:19 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Is his term over already?

He continues to promise to do something. The REAL issue is not that he has broken promises...its that some people naively thought that he would make this his priority (as if he didn't already have enough issues to deal with on day one).

The man has four years in office. Only a spoiled selfcentered few ever expected him to address this before he got some of his big agenda items passed.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 11:23:24 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

It sounds like you're saying

people were fools to believe Obama.  I agree.

I am not interested in picking up crumbs of compassion thrown from the table of someone who considers himself my master. I want the full menu of rights.  -Archbishop Desmond Tutu

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by: QScribe @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 15:29:57 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

What ScFiGeek said

So Obama says the right thing and you condemn him. That's just effed up. Part of the way he will get things done is by saying the right thing over and over again. He's not, thank God, the emperor of the universe.

Don't call me an Obamabot and I won't call you a fucktard rightwing delusional idiot pretending to be a leftist. Deal?

--ish

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by: ish @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 11:54:37 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

for clarity

I was replying to Qscribe. I agree with ScFi Geek.

--ish

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by: ish @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 13:00:46 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Dear me, I've upset the Obamabot

Your--and Geek's--ongoing attempts to claim that only right-wingers are critical of Obama would be pathetic if it weren't so obviously fanciful.  Talk about living in an alternate reality...!

And despite all the inflammatory personal attacks, you still haven't addressed the issue I raised in my post:  In nearly a year, Obama has done nothing for us.  NOTHING.  Calling people who disagree with you vile names doesn't change that.

I am not interested in picking up crumbs of compassion thrown from the table of someone who considers himself my master. I want the full menu of rights.  -Archbishop Desmond Tutu

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by: QScribe @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 15:37:42 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Perhaps you aren't hearing well.

If he utters the word incrementalism, he is not saying the right thing.

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...

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by: dyssonance @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 20:12:55 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

If this is the stale message that the President is going to serve up

Then I would hope (probably quite unlikely, given Secret Service) that the banquet attendees would throw their stale dinner rolls towards the podium, amidst a chorus of boos.

But then, that would make us no better than the teabag crowd, and we are certainly above that.

Truth be told, however, all advances are incremental.  The difference here is that there have been no advances at the federal legislative level at all!

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by: Phil @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:26:24 AM CDT

Oh joy

Now I can expect to hear another round of "incrementalism" arguments aimed at transfolks, can't I?

It was lies then, it's lies now, and if the message is "work it in pieces" instead of "all together now", I will indeed have a cow all over the internet.

Followed, of course, by the usual "calm down" rhetoric.

Incementalism is the watchword of assimilationists, imo -- its all about not making waves, and listening to those who know better than you.

Should prove interesting...

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...

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by: dyssonance @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:29:22 AM CDT

I agree a timid speech of nothing special, won't even please HRC folks

If this is the final draft of the remarks I wouldn't be suprised if some guests choose not to attend.

The Marchers will be P*SSED.
I guess we might see this leak as a trial balloon to see how P*SSED we'll be, and make revisions to make it more palatable.

I have to comment on the photo of Obama, which is very Twilight Zone lighting and unflattering angle.
I remember when we were hopeful of candidate Obama the images were like this:
  http://www.pinknews.co.uk/imag...

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small

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by: peteyPornpig @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:30:52 AM CDT

As mentioned earlier

I believe the incremental progress will be the inclusion of the Matthew Shepard act in the Defence spending bill.  The problem with incremental advancements is that momentum can be lost at any time, something not lost on anyone involved.  It is called into play when a politician must balance two opposing influences.  By providing the very minimum required to one group he or she can hope to avoid losing the support of the other.  In this case I believe the President is balancing doing the right thing with the vast political power of American Christians.  As we have been told, he must be "forced" to support us.  Let's get to work...

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by: sarasnavel @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:47:23 AM CDT

shoot

If this plays out, it will be a shockingly stupid, disrespectful, marginalizing, condescending speech.  I hope he learned something from the DOJ face-slap a few months back.  But if not, as with the DOJ mess, I predict even fewer, smaller HRC and Democratic campaign donations.  And increasing donations of time and money to progressive candidates and parties.  We just have to remind our non-LGBT progressive allies to have our backs.

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by: 555catnap @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:55:18 AM CDT

I wonder

what bookmakers are setting the odds that someone will yell

"YOU LIE!"

Dena

Cisgender. Because "Genetic" is so 2006.

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by: Denabeth @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 00:57:00 AM CDT

Put me within mic-shot

and let him utter incrementalism, and you can bet your sweet hind end I will.

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...

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by: dyssonance @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 05:31:49 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Dear 'Fierce Advocate'

You say 'incremental advancements' , I say kiss my gay ass. Can I have my vote back?

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by: LoveMoby @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 01:04:17 AM CDT

Feel free to vote

Republican in 2010 and 2012. THEN see how much respect you get from the federal government.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 09:41:24 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

About as much as we're getting now.

I am not interested in picking up crumbs of compassion thrown from the table of someone who considers himself my master. I want the full menu of rights.  -Archbishop Desmond Tutu

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by: QScribe @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 11:15:15 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

As I said...

feel free to vote for the Republicans. Everything else can go to shit, but atleast you'll feel better having the government ignore you, actively demonize you, and trying to change the Constitution to marginalize you even further.

If you don't see a significant difference between the two then by all means, help out the GOP.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 11:40:15 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

As you said...

Actually I DONT and WONT feel better voting for the Republicans and if you think I do then youre just as batshit crazy as they are!

My point is, the GOP openly hate us, the DNC subtly dislike us. We lose either way.

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by: LoveMoby @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 12:33:24 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Laughably oversimplified

Since there is virtually no difference between the two, except rhetorically (the Democrats sure talk a better game), there is no reason to support either party.  Your ongoing assertion that we all must feel obligated to support one or the other makes no conceivable sense.

I am not interested in picking up crumbs of compassion thrown from the table of someone who considers himself my master. I want the full menu of rights.  -Archbishop Desmond Tutu

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by: QScribe @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 15:27:09 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

In case you missed it

Hey in case you missed it, we dont get ANY respect from the Feds now! If you cant pass anything worthwhile with close to 60 votes  in the Senate and a majority in the House why do we keep voting at all? We know the Repubs hate us but I'm not exactly feeling the love with the Dems. Sorry if that offends you but it's the reality.  

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by: LoveMoby @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 11:29:04 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

thanks.....awfully for YOUR permission for ME to vote

Really you have no power in that arena, so save your breath

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small

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by: peteyPornpig @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 12:01:35 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Shit

If there is one single word that he should NOT utter on Saturday, "incrementalism" would be it.

As Dyssonance laments:

Now I can expect to hear another round of "incrementalism" arguments aimed at transfolks, can't I?

If so, they'll now have the imprimatur of a man who, while a state legislator, supported trans-inclusion.

I knew that Solmonese was gearing up to screw us yet again.  And if there was one way he could out-do his 'Southern Comfort Two-Face' performance of 2007, this would be it.

I presume that there is some way in which he could use that word that would not be a de facto license to the 'We Wanna Be Like Barney Frank' League to strip us from ENDA, but if he uses the word the way in which it always is used in the LGBT context, my support for Obama will end the second that it passes his lips.

Hope?

Nope.

>^..^<

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by: KatRose @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 01:40:32 AM CDT

Pardon my French...

...but F&#% "incrementalism" or "gradualism" or whatever he wants to call it.

This is no time to engage in the luxury of cooling off or to take the tranquilizing drug of gradualism. Now is the time to make real the promises of democracy.--Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

I think gradualism is so often an excuse for escapism, and "do nothing-ism," which ends up in "stand still-ism." --Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

If all Obama plans to do is toot his own horn about how progressive he is on gay rights by playing up signing a law over a decade overdue and appointing a gay ambassador and ask us to be patient with the slower than snail's pace the Democrapic Party is going on GLBT rights, he deserves to be booed off the dais. We are not going to be patient. Having infinite patience only leads down the road to perpetual oppression.

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by: craigkg @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 02:40:27 AM CDT

booed off the dias?

Won't happen. The spoiled do-nothing queens that attend HRC black tie dinner won't want their faaaaaaabulous evening ruined by anything "negative."  

Now hand over your $25 and buy that cute lil' + sign shirt! Joe has a mortgage to pay.

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by: emjsea @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 10:36:31 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

We had the Hope, where's the Change?

If you have tickets to this shindig, you might want to consider getting a refund. $250 is $250 too much to pay for five month old warmed-over Cowardly Pandering Bullshit ala Obama. Even with a little cheese sprinkled on top and a new parsley garnish, it's still leftover Bullshit.

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi

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by: Keori @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 04:09:40 AM CDT

Incremental? Like SONDA in New York?

If you don't know about that lie it's the same one the Log Cabin types served up when Frank introduced the Barney Bill in 2007. When in New York state ENDA was passed in 2002 as a gay-only bill, SONDA, they promised to come back for the transfolk. Guess what, it's seven years later and GENDA is dead in the water. Want to tear apart the LGBT alliance? Try a repeat of the 2007 ENDA sellout.

Free Your Mind at http://brainfood.glamazon.net

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by: ChristineBeatty @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 04:46:00 AM CDT

"Want to tear apart the LGBT alliance?"

You're assuming that this isn't precisely what many, if not the majority, of those who can afford to attend this thing would like to see.  The Aravosisists who believe not only that trans people have no place in the movement but also that women and bisexuals were too uppity in demanding to be listed are the A-Gay demographic.

>^..^<

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by: KatRose @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 06:20:22 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Sorry Kat -- hate to disappoint you

99% of the tickets were sold well before the Obama speech announcement and a good portion were already spoken for before NEM was on the calendar.

This is NOT what we "A-Gays" are expecting to see.  I guarantee that if we get "incremental progress", you'll see a tepid response that will be the story leading into the NEM.

BTW -- this "A-Gay" wrote the non-discrimination policy at my corporation -- including writing the transition guidelines and handbook, got the company to endorse a fully-inclusive ENDA, and a host of other things... so pardon me for using my position and access to get those things done.

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by: txmichael @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 08:19:16 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Your transition guideliness included the fact that HIPAA laws cover it, right?

An make it clear that without the active consent of the employee transitioning, no mention can be made of anything.

They did that, right?

Just checking.

Me, I say use your access -- use it, embrace, capitalize one it for yourself and your broader community.

Just be sure to be educated on the issues of that community, as a whole, and make changes for the better ;)

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...

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by: dyssonance @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 20:11:03 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Is "incremental"

Obama's pet name for Maine?

Since he has STILL yet to mention LD 1020's passage into law back in May...

Maybe that's why Olympia Snowe, Susan Collins and Mike Michaud have been dead silent. Shall we be hearing them say "incremental" soon to the Maine or national media outlets?

GAH.

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

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by: Louise @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 07:03:18 AM CDT

I can't wait for this speech

Precisely because I cannot wait to see some collecte head explosions when it once again becomes apparent that the unreasonable politically tone deaf activists don't get their way AGAIN.

Hell, angry LGBT folks only helps Obama with that large proportion of Americans that don't like LGBT people anyway.

The fact is, neither the White House or the Democrats are going to allow themselves to become political martyrs and comit political suicide by publically pushing hard on gay issues. The rest of the American people are demanding that the government stay focused on key issues. The Democrats know that they stand to lose everything by pushing a losing position on culture war issues.

Its unfortunate that so many people are detached from political reality that they expect the White House the push this loudly. Progress will happen SLOWLY and as quietly as possible. Hate crimes is going to pass by attaching it to something else. ENDA will probably pass in the same way. A DOMA repeal is DOA for now.

Being pro LGBT is not a winning position for the Democrats on the national level. People need to come to terms with that. Anyone who cannot deal with that is free to vote for the Republicans so that the government can go back to pretending that you don't exist.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 09:56:04 AM CDT

I mostly agree...but

it's not that being pro-LGBT is not a winning position for the Democrats. It's not the position that the's issue. The "position" ie the platform is mostly great. And we need that repeated over and over again.

It's the reality of laying that platform on the line when it is not actually agreed to by the people in government--ie, congress-who actually need to MAKE the changes.

Those who complain about what Obama has not actually done for us haven't really offered any suggestion about how all these things will get through Congress where it's simply not so easily done as said.

--ish

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by: ish @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 10:50:23 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

This is certainly true...

but it is part of a broader problem about political tone deafness that infects many of the activists. Some simply cannot fathom why the President would not make this front an center right away. I mean, yeah, he's fighting for a stimulus package, a fairly progressive budget, trying to keep the economy from falling off of a cliff, managing two wars full of bad options, dealing with North Korea, Iran, the Arab Israeli conflict, trying to hammer out a new arms agreement with Russia, reforming healthcare, and all the while dealing with a right wing determined to stop ANYTHING he does.

Somehow, these people can look at that list and then seriously get upset that LGBT issues have not been touched in the last 9 months. Reasonable people look at that list and think to themselves, he's got a lot to focus on and four years in office...lets give him some time to address the central issues facing the nation.

But no, its NOW NOW NOW with these people. If he does not do something NOW then he was obviously lying when he said he would address the issue.

Its the hysterical shrieking and the unreasonable expectations that is the real problem.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 11:34:23 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

agreed, ScFi Geek

(though I personally try to avoid using that hysterical shrieking stereotype due to the unfortunate root misogyny of that word)

--ish

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by: ish @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 13:04:44 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

While gay marriage is still not fully supported nationwide

I don't think other gay equality issues are DOA on a nationwide level. DADT repeal is highly supported and ENDA.

Like usual, pols are the last to get with the program. You and others are still in the 90s mindset.  

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by: DilworthDem @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 12:26:50 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

actually...

I said DOMA was DOA. The other issues will be addressed in the fullness of time.

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by: SciFi Geek @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 15:32:45 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

how will they react?

Why they'll lick it up off the floor like good doggies and smile and beg for one more scrap. Obama is a disappointment and a coward. I'm sorry I wasted my donation and vote for him. And unless EDNA and UAFA are passed along with the repeal of DOMA and DADT I won't be making the same mistake next time around. Believe that.

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by: emjsea @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 10:34:15 AM CDT

How about...

... jobs, housing, economic parity, the ability to exist as 'evidence of progress'.

What a tormenting morning of news.

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by: pantherq @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 11:05:01 AM CDT

Seems Obama has forgotten what FIERCE means

Luckily Sunday he'll get a refresher course.

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small

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by: peteyPornpig @ Fri Oct 09, 2009 at 20:37:53 PM CDT