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Live: hate crimes bill signing -- reactions

by: Pam Spaulding

Wed Oct 28, 2009 at 14:44:28 PM EDT


The Advocate has a livestream. Gab about it in the Blend chat room.

UPDATE: Excerpt of the remarks by the President about the hate crimes provision:

THE WHITE HOUSE

Office of the Press Secretary

_________________________________________

For Immediate Release                      October 28, 2009

REMARKS BY THE PRESIDENT
AT THE SIGNING OF THE NATIONAL DEFENSE AUTHORIZATION ACT
FOR FISCAL YEAR 2010

East Room

2:42 P.M. EDT

...Now, speaking of that, there is one more long-awaited change contained within this legislation that I'll be talking about a little more later today.  After more than a decade of opposition and delay, we've passed inclusive hate crimes legislation to help protect our citizens from violence based on what they look like, who they love, how they pray, or who they are.  (Applause.)

I promised Judy Shepard, when she saw me in the Oval Office, that this day would come, and I'm glad that she and her husband Dennis could join us for this event.  I'm also honored to have the family of the late Senator Ted Kennedy, who fought so hard for this legislation.  And Vicki and Patrick, Kara, everybody who's here, I just want you all to know how proud we are of the work that Ted did to help this day -- make this day possible.  So -- and thank you for joining us here today.  (Applause.)

So, with that, I'm going to sign this piece of legislation.  Thank you all for doing a great job.  All right.

Reactions to the signing are up:

Judy Shepard:

"After a decade of debate, persistent advocacy and 14 separate congressional floor votes, President Barack Obama today signed into law the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act in a White House ceremony attended by the Shepard and Byrd families.

"When Dennis and I started calling 10 years ago for federal action to prevent and properly prosecute hate crimes against gay, lesbian and transgendered Americans, we never imagined it would take this long," said Judy Shepard, Matthew¹s mother and the president of the Matthew Shepard Foundation Board of Directors.

"The legislation went through so many versions and so many votes that we had to constantly keep our hopes in check to keep from getting discouraged," she continued. "But with President Obama¹s support and the continually growing bipartisan majorities in the House and Senate lining up behind the bill this year, it became clear that 2009 was the year it would finally happen."

The legislation allows federal authorities to pursue charges in violent crimes motivated by the victim¹s actual or perceived sexual orientation, gender, gender identity and disability, in cases where local authorities cannot or will not secure appropriate convictions. It also opens up federal aid to local law enforcement for training, prevention and investigation.

"We are incredibly grateful to Congress and the president for taking this step forward on behalf of hate crime victims and their families, especially given the continuing attacks on people simply for living their lives openly and honestly," Shepard added. "But each of us can and must do much more to ensure true equality for all Americans."

The Matthew Shepard Foundation¹s work for an inclusive society continues after passage of this landmark legislation. In addition to advocating for workplace and housing equality, equal rights for same-sex couples, and an end to the ban on gay and lesbian military service, the Foundation continues to reach out to schools and corporations nationwide to encourage respect for human dignity and differences."

Rep. Tammy Baldwin:

"Just moments ago, I returned from the White House, where President Obama signed the Matthew Shepard Hate Crimes Act into law.  It was an incredibly moving ceremony-Judy and Dennis Shepard were in the front row watching this historic event. I had the chance to speak with both of them before the ceremony began and to recognize their incredible efforts to make this day possible.

Hate crimes are a particularly horrific type of crime.  Many have characterized it as acts of domestic terrorism, because not only is there an immediate victim of violence who's selected by virtue of a characteristic such as race, or religion, or sexual orientation, or gender identity; but once that crime occurs, it sends a terrorizing message to all who share that characteristic.

I remember where I was and what was happening when the news of Matthew Shepard's murder began to circulate. I remember how many people I encountered who felt scared and frightened themselves because such a heinous attack had been perpetrated against him because of his sexual orientation. It is high time that this Act become law.  It has been an effort that I've worked on ever since I came to the Congress of the United States, and I think it will send a very powerful message.

Believe it or not, this is the first piece of legislation dealing with LGBT civil rights ever to be signed into law at the federal level. I do hope it will be the first of many yet to come, so that we are able to achieve full equality in the years and months ahead."

More below the fold.

Pam Spaulding :: Live: hate crimes bill signing -- reactions
As President Obama today signed the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, the following 29 organizations issued this joint statement:
History in the Making

It took much too long, more than a decade. And it came at too great a price: the brutal killings of Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. are just two among the thousands of crimes motivated by hate and bigotry.

But this week, the president put pen to paper and fulfilled a campaign promise, the signing of the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, extending the federal hate crimes statute to include sexual orientation and gender identity along with race, religion, gender, national origin and disability. Our deepest hope and strong belief is that this new law will save lives. Now, lawmakers and the president have made an imperative statement to the country and the world: Our nation will no longer tolerate hate-motivated violence against lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) people.

We have worked long and hard for this and its passage is historic.

According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation's Uniform Crime Reporting Program, there are nearly 8,000 hate crime-related incidents annually, and more than 1,200 of those incidents involve violence based on sexual orientation or gender identity. And even more alarming, while the overall occurrence of hate crimes is declining nationally, hate crimes against LGBT people have been increasing. This year alone, we saw hate crimes trials in the brutal killings of two transgender women, Angie Zapata and Lateisha Green.

As a result of this legislation, if local jurisdictions are unable or unwilling to investigate or prosecute hate crimes based on sexual orientation or gender identity, the Justice Department can now step in. And that's why the LGBT community never stopped working for this historic day.

This legislation not only has practical value, but is a symbol of our progress. It is the first time in the nation's history that Congress has passed explicit protections on the basis of sexual orientation and gender identity. We could not have reached this moment without the powerful support of our allies who stood with us every step of the way. We are deeply grateful to civil rights, civic, faith and disability rights groups, as well as law enforcement and district attorney organizations that worked side by side with the LGBT advocates. We are equally thankful to Congress, President Obama and members of his administration for passing and signing this bill into law.

While today we celebrate this marker of progress, we must recognize it as only one of the building blocks to full equality and demand that it be just a first step toward equal treatment under federal law in all areas of our lives. And we must focus on the next step.

The passage of the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act provides us with an opportunity. We must use this moment to educate and keep the momentum going so that we can continue to make progress on the local, state and federal levels. Yes, legislation takes a long time - often years of work. Yet, our community is on the cusp of passing much-needed protections.

This week, we call upon lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people, families and allies to take this opportunity of increased media and public attention on hate crimes to educate co-workers, classmates, neighbors, family members and friends about our lives, and about why we need not only their friendship and love, but their vocal support for a more just and equal America for LGBT people. If your members of Congress voted in support of hate crimes legislation, call them and thank them. Then ask them to be there for us again when the vote turns to workplace nondiscrimination, military service and partnership rights.

With your help and our collective pressure, equality is within reach.

When talking about the need for hate crimes legislation, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said: "The time for debate is over."

She was right.

Just as the time has finally come for stronger hate crime protections, it is also time to pass an inclusive Employment Non-Discrimination Act, repeal "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" and the so-called Defense of Marriage Act, and ensure that health care, economic policy and immigration reform incorporate the needs of LGBT people.

The time for debate is over.

Signed by:

Jo Kenny, AFL-CIO Pride at Work
Terry Stone, Centerlink: The Community of LGBT Centers
Gabe Javier, Consortium of Higher Education LGBT Resource Professionals
Marianne Duddy-Burke, DignityUSA
Toni Broaddus, Equality Federation
Jennifer Chrisler, Family Equality Council
Evan Wolfson, Freedom to Marry
Lee Swislow, Gay & Lesbian Advocates & Defenders
Rebecca Allison, M.D., Gay & Lesbian Medical Association
Chuck Wolfe, Gay & Lesbian Victory Fund
Eliza Byard, Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network
Marjorie Hill, Gay Men's Health Crisis
Joe Solmonese, Human Rights Campaign
Rachel Tiven, Immigration Equality
Earl Fowlkes, International Federation of Black Prides
Kevin M. Cathcart, Lambda Legal
Leslie Calman, Mautner Project: The National Lesbian Health Organization
Sharon Lettman, National Black Justice Coalition
Kate Kendell, National Center for Lesbian Rights
Mara Keisling, National Center for Transgender Equality
Justin Nelson, National Gay & Lesbian Chamber of Commerce
Rea Carey, National Gay and Lesbian Task Force
Paul Kawata, National Minority AIDS Council
Kyle Bailey, National Stonewall Democrats
Greg Varnum, National Youth Advocacy Coalition
Sharon Stapel, New York Anti-Violence Project
Jody Michael Huckaby, PFLAG National
Michael Adams, Services and Advocacy for GLBT Elders (SAGE)
Aubrey Sarvis, Servicemembers Legal Defense Network

HRC's Joe Solmonese:

"This law honors our lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender brothers and sisters whose lives were cut short because of hate," said Human Rights Campaign President Joe Solmonese. "Today's signing of the first major piece of civil rights legislation to protect LGBT Americans represents a historic milestone in the inevitable march towards equality. Although this is a major step in fighting the scourge of hate violence, it is not the end of the road. As a community, we will continue to dedicate ourselves to changing not only laws but also hearts and minds. We know that hate crimes not only harm individuals, but they terrorize entire communities. After more than a decade of advocacy, local police and sheriffs' departments now have the full resources of the Justice Department available to them."

"We applaud President Obama for signing this bill into law and thank the leadership and our allies in the House and Senate. We also will always remember the tireless efforts of Senator Edward Kennedy on this issue. Senator Kennedy once said that this legislation sends 'a message about freedom and equality that will resonate around the world.' This marks the first time that we as a nation have explicitly protected the LGBT community in the law. And this law sends a loud message that perpetrators of hate violence against anyone will be brought to justice," said Solmonese.

For a comprehensive retrospective and historical overview of hate crimes advocacy visit: www.LoveConquersHate.org.

The Task Force:

Statement by Rea Carey, Executive Director, National Gay and Lesbian Task Force

"Today marks a historic milestone for lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people, and for the entire country. With the president's signing of the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, both sexual orientation and gender identity have, for the first time in U.S. history, been explicitly included in federal law.

"It has taken over a decade of perseverance to get to this momentous day, and we thank all those who have worked to achieve this incredible victory. Laws embody the values of our nation, and through the enactment of this hate crimes law, our country has - once and for all - sent a clear and unequivocal message that it rejects and condemns all forms of hate violence, including crimes motivated by hatred of lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people.

"We look forward to the days ahead when we will join together again to celebrate full equality and recognition of our community, including in employment, the military and in the full recognition of our families. The Task Force is committed to the work necessary to bring full equality to the lives of lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people. We know that we have much work ahead of us. Today, we must pause and shine a light on this critical first step taken by Congress, and the willingness of this president to follow through on his promise to sign this legislation ensuring the laws of the land will protect all of us."

More on the Task Force's work on hate crimes legislation

*Passage of hate crimes legislation stems from decades of work, much of it spearheaded by the Task Force, including:

*In 1982, the Task Force founded the groundbreaking anti-violence project, the first national organizing project for anti-LGBT hate crimes.

*In 1990, the Task Force secured the Hate Crimes Statistics Act, which included sexual orientation, in large part justified by the Task Force's own statistics on hate crimes. The Hate Crimes Statistics Act was pushed so that national data could build the foundation for a hate crimes law.

*Murders and arsons, some anti-LGBT and others based on race and other characteristics, led President Bill Clinton to call for a White House Summit on Hate Crimes in 1997, attended by then-Task Force Executive Director Kerry Lobel, where she delivered a petition signed by LGBT people all over the country asking for a serious response to anti-LGBT hate crimes. Out of this meeting, the Hate Crimes Prevention Act (the predecessor to today's legislation) was written; it fixed several problems with the existing hate crimes law on race, religion and national origin, and added sexual orientation, gender and disability to the law.

*In 2001, the Task Force started its work to add gender identity to the bill. Over the course of years and bringing along coalition partners, the Task Force secured a "gender identity" addition into the House legislation in 2005, with the Senate bill becoming transgender-inclusive in 2007.

*The Task Force continued to advocate for the bill's passage, repeatedly activating its membership.

*In 2009, when the hate crimes bill was added to the Department of Defense authorization bill and a death penalty provision was added in the Senate, the Task Force spoke out about the immorality of inclusion of the death penalty and activated its grassroots to urge the provision be struck from the final language. The conference committee ultimately removed the capital punishment language.

People for the American Way:

"We've struggled for many years to enact this legislation, but I am deeply grateful to see these protections become federal law," said Reverend Timothy McDonald, People For the American Way board member and chairman of the African American Ministers In Action. "This bill exemplifies our deepest American values, it ensures strong action against senseless violence against people targeted simply because of who they are, and furthermore it will protect the religious freedom of all clergy to speak out on any issue they feel passionately about. It is shameful that opponents of this bill and the Religious Right have waged a dishonest and unfair campaign against it, and I am thankful to all those who stood up to defend those most in need."

Right wing opponents of the bill have repeatedly attacked the legislation, falsely claiming that the legislation would impinge on First Amendment rights. In fact, the bill contains important provisions to ensure that clergy members can preach about any issue-including homosexuality-without fear of government censure.

"This is a major step towards ensuring equality under the law for all people," said Michael B. Keegan, President of People For the American Way. "It's been more than a decade since Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. were murdered, but at long last the legislation bearing their names has become a law. I hope that Congress will move quickly to follow this bill with legislation ending Don't Ask, Don't Tell, repealing the so-called Defense of Marriage Act, and finally enacting the long overdue Employment Non Discrimination Act."

The Hate Crimes legislation, which was attached to the Department of Defense authorization bill, includes protections based on gender identity-the first time gender identity will receive positive protection in federal law.

"As we commemorate the signing of this bill, it is appropriate that we remember the unflagging leadership of Senator Kennedy," said Keegan. "Without his tireless and passionate work in support of this measure, this day would not be possible. This legislation is yet one more piece of his enduring legacy of making our core Constitutional values real faor all Americans."

Out and Equal:

Out & Equal Workplace Advocates applauds President Barack Obama's signing into law the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, which will strengthen federal hate crimes legislation by expanding coverage to include crimes based on actual or perceived sexual orientation, gender, gender identity or disability.
This is the first federal law in the nation's history that is specifically inclusive of the full lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community, a historic and significant move in the LGBT civil rights movement, signaling a new era in this country in which everyone can be treated equally.

"History is being made by federal leaders who are taking a stand to protect the LGBT community from the hate-motivated violence that has existed for far too long," said  Out & Equal Workplace Advocates Founding Executive Director Selisse Berry. "We celebrate this milestone, but we can't forget the people - Mathew Shephard, James Byrd, Jr., Gwen Araujo and thousands of others - who have been victims of hate because of who they are."

"We hope that federal leaders' decision to protect LGBT Americans from hate-motivated crimes sets the course for federal policies that will protect the LGBT population on all fronts, including discrimination in the workplace through the passage of the Employment Non-Discrimination Act," Berry said.

"We're on the cusp of achieving the protections and equitable rights that countless people before us have sought, and we can't stop now. We must continue contacting our Congressional delegates to gain their support, and ultimately assuring that every LGBT person - whether it's you, your son, daughter, brother, sister, mother or father - can live their lives without fear."

Equality California:

Equality California hailed the signing today of the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, a federal law combating hate crimes against lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) individuals.

"We are thrilled that President Obama has signed this fundamental piece of legislation, which ensures that the federal government will fulfill its obligation to protect all people of this nation, including LGBT people," said EQCA Executive Director Geoff Kors. "We applaud the President and Congress for joining California in standing up against violence based on hate. We are especially grateful to Assemblymember Pedro Nava who authored the hate crimes resolution this year, former Senator Sheila Kuehl who authored the original California Hate Crimes Law and the LGBT Caucus and legislators who supported the numerous hate crimes bills and resolutions passed in California."

Earlier this year, Equality California sponsored companion resolutions that call on the United States Congress to immediately pass and President Obama to sign the Matthew Shepard Act, which expands the landmark 1969 United States federal hate crimes law to include crimes motivated by a victim's real or perceived gender, sexual orientation, gender identity and disability.

"The President believes every human being is entitled to equality and the same dignity and protection under the law," said Assemblymember Pedro Nava (D-Santa Barbara). "Signing this crucial legislation will help curb violence against the LGBT community and provide needed resources and funding to local law enforcement."

CenterLink:

A great and historic moment in the fight for LGBT equality in America occurred today as President Obama signed the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act into law. After passing in both the House and the Senate by comfortable margins, and receiving today's signature from the President, the new law extends authority to fully investigate and prosecute bias-motivated crimes where the victim has been targeted because of actual or perceived gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, or disability.

"I cannot begin to express the joy and thankfulness I feel today," said Terry Stone, Executive Director of CenterLink: The Community of LGBT Centers. "We applaud everyone who worked tirelessly to get this bill passed, and look forward to continuing our work for full equality for the LGBT community."

Lambda Legal:
"It took much too long, more than a decade.  And it came at too great a price: the brutal killings of Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. are just two among the thousands of crimes motivated by hate and bigotry.

"But this week, the president put pen to paper and fulfilled a campaign promise, the signing of the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, extending the federal hate crimes statute to include sexual orientation and gender identity along with race, religion, gender, national origin and disability. Our deepest hope and strong belief is that this new law will save lives.  Now, lawmakers and the President have made an imperative statement to the country and the world: Our nation will no longer tolerate hatred motivated violence against LGBT people.

"We have worked long and hard for this and its passage is historic.

"According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation's Uniform Crime Reporting Program, there are nearly 8000 hate-crime related incidents annually, and more than 1200 of those incidents involve violence based on sexual orientation or gender identity. And even more alarming, while the overall occurrence of hate crimes is declining nationally, hate crimes against LGBT people have been increasing.  This year alone, we saw hate crimes trials in the brutal killings of two transgender women, Angie Zapata and Lateisha Green.

"As a result of this legislation, if local jurisdictions are unable or unwilling to investigate or prosecute hate crimes based on sexual orientation or gender identity, the Justice Department can now step in.  And that's why the LGBT community never stopped working for this historic day.

"This legislation not only has practical value, but is a symbol of our progress.  It is the first time in the nation's history that Congress has passed explicit protections on the basis of sexual orientation and gender identity. We could not have reached this moment without the powerful support of our allies who stood with us every step of the way. We are deeply grateful to civil rights, civic, faith, and disability rights groups, as well as law enforcement and district attorney organizations who worked side-by-side with the LGBT advocates. We are equally thankful to Congress, President Obama, and members of his administration for passing and signing this bill into law.

GLAAD:
"With this law, President Obama and Congress have sent a message that violence against lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people is wrong and that our community should not be excluded from the protections of our nation's laws" said GLAAD President Jarrett Barrios.  "This is a landmark step in eliminating the kind of hate motivated violence that has taken the lives of so many in our community including Brandon Teena, Matthew Shepard, Fred Martinez, Gwen Araujo, Sakia Gunn, Sean Kennedy, Angie Zapata, Duanna Johnson, Lateisha Green and so many others. The visibility of these tragic losses and the conversations that they sparked brought us to today's historic step toward ending this violence."

GLAAD has worked with media outlets and families of victims to raise visibility among the public about the need for LGBT-inclusive federal protections.

"We especially thank Judy and Dennis Shepard and so many of the families of those who have lost their lives to hate violence for their tireless commitment, along with so many individuals and organizations, to educate people about the importance of this legislation."

"Today is another step toward full equality, where LGBT people can be respected and feel safe in our communities with the knowledge that the laws will protect us too. Our community's work is far from over and media have the same responsibility today as they've always had: to continue telling the stories of LGBT victims of hate violence until the day that anti-LGBT violence is truly and finally a thing of the past."

Equality Across America:
"It's good that the U.S. government has finally taken action to deter hate crimes against lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people.  But by continuing to permit or even require discrimination against LGBT people in our relationships, in public service and in the workplace, the government fuels the very bigotry that results in violent attacks," said Tanner Efinger of Equality Across America.

Passage of the Act shows that escalated protest over the past year, such as at the National Equality March (NEM) on October 11th, is putting significant pressure on Congress to address anti-LGBT discrimination.

"We applaud and congratulate Matthew Shepard's mom, Judy, who has inspired so many over the last eleven years and did so again when she spoke at the National Equality March, this October," said Robin McGehee, co-director of the NEM.  "She has truly shown what being a fierce advocate for equality and justice is truly about, even after facing such a horrible tragedy based in hate."

National Black Justice Coalition:
"By signing this act into law, this administration sends a clear message that the civil rights of every American are worth protecting and defending," said Sharon J. Lettman, NBJC Executive Director.  "No one should have to live their life in fear of violence simply for living their life openly."

..."NBJC has long advocated on behalf of hate crime victims," said Kylar Broadus, NBJC Board Chair, "including Sakia Gunn, Laetisha Greene, and other transgender African Americans who are disproportionately targets of hate crimes."

Gwen Smith's Remembering our Dead List, a website which tracks anti-transgender violence, notes about 70% of transgender victims are African-American.

African Americans and LGBT individuals are consistently among those most frequently targeted by bias-related crime. Of the hate crime incidents reported nationwide in 2007, 34 percent were perpetrated against African Americans, a number and percentage of incidents that has changed little over the past 10 years.  

Congressman Barney Frank:
Today, Congressman Barney Frank attended the White House signing ceremony for the historic Matthew Shepard & James Byrd Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act.  He released the following statement.

"This is a bittersweet day.  It is sweet because this is the first law in American history that begins the job of protecting lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people against prejudice.  But it is bitter because this bill comes too late to save countless victims."

"Our job now is to enact fully inclusive legislation to prevent job discrimination, to repeal Don't Ask, Don't Tell, and to begin the job of winning recognition of same-sex relationships on the federal level."

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The Hate Crimes Bill is a Travesty
"Violence against lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people is wrong. So is violence against people in Afghanistan and Iraq. But in the bizarre culture of identity politics, there are no alliances among the oppressed. The Matthew Shepard and James Byrd Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, the first major federal ci...vil rights law protecting lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people, passed last week, was attached to a $680-billion measure outlining the Pentagon's budget, which includes $130 billion for ongoing military operations in Iraq and Afghanistan. The Democratic majority in Congress, under the cover of protecting some innocents, authorized massive acts of violence against other innocents."

The philosopher Theodor Adorno wrote, in words gay activists should have heeded, that exclusive preoccupation with personal concerns and indifference to the suffering of others beyond the self-identified group made fascism and the Holocaust possible.


Yeh, renwl...

you should know a lot about the Holocaust given you're fond of quoting one of the homohating fellow travelers of the authors of The Pink Swatsika which blames gays for the Third Reich.

Heal thyself....


[ Parent ]
Yea Michael, What eves...
And guess what? You can't shut me up. Tee hee.  

[ Parent ]
Hey, We're patriotic LGBT's
We support the war and oppose DADT as weaking our country in the face of our enemies

On a serious note, you wouldn't be popular in NYC when you oppose going after the Taliban and the masterminds of the criminal attack upon what was the world's largest civilian office complex.

Over three thousand innocents died in a day at the hand of an enemy that counts success by the number of civilian dead, enslaves women and murders LGBT's

Our support of the military is consistent with opposing those who would destroy us.

I dined at the WTC(Windows on the World, One World Trade Center) on 9-10-01. Many friends of mine died at Cantor,Fitzgerald the following day when Islamic Radicals set the terms of engagement to include civilian targets.

Don't lecture me on "innocents" when those "innocents" hide, protect and provide sustinance to the murderers of LGBT's in their own countries and murderers of innocents in London and Manhattan.

I honestly would have no moral or legal qualms about carpet bombing areas where the enemy is to be found, since they set the rules of engagement on 9-11 and it was set at inclusion of civilian targets.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
Speak for yourself
I don't consider the murder of civilian men, women and children in Afghanistan or Iraq to be in any way excusable. If that's patriotism, count me out.

There's absolutely no difference in being a poor Afghan villager killed out of the blue one day by an invisible US drone than being an office worker at Cantor Fitzgerald unexpectedly doomed by terrorism.

While I disagree with Renwl that the attachment of the hate crimes bill to a military appropriations bill cheapens it--sadly that's just how politics is done--there is a kernel of irony in his/her argument that the Hate Crimes bill will not protect foreign innocents from the casual disregard of US foreign policy.

The Hate Crimes bill remains a victory but there are others yet to be won.

--ish


[ Parent ]
They set the rules of engagement
and there is no basis in international law for a claim that civilian lives or neutral property are sacrosanct when they are harbouring and supporting belligerants.

And many agree with me, because they believe that if people will not drive international criminals out from their midst, they surrender their right to be free from attack for as long as the military objective dwells amongst them and they continue to provide them sanctuary and support

Brutal?
Yes
Legal?
Yes.



I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
You left one thing out
Moral?
No!

--ish

[ Parent ]
Moral? Yes
Because, otherwise, chasing them behind the human shields of civilians supporting them will cost the lives of our soldiers unnecessarily.

Unnecessarily.

You go to Dover AFB sometime and preach the morality of wasting their sons and daughters lives to the families waaiting for those horrid metal boxes covered in flags, Go there, stand with them and tell them that your precious nurturance of villagers assisting our enemies was worth the lives of their loved ones.

I've stood there with friends.

Let's see you show some "stones"

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
Sad
That you value some life more than others. The Taliban fighters killed by drone attacks--repugnant as their beliefs and politics might be--are home in their beds with their wives and kids when all are killed without warning without trial or nothing. Who of those murdered innocents might turn out to be gay were circumstances different?

That "human shields" garbage is your rationalization, just like the rationalization used to excuse all murdering war machines by people who should know better. When you start believing it that's when the ultimate corruption sets in.

Anwyay, this is borderline threadjacking; and fascinating since it's usually me defending the prez and you attacking.

This hate crimes bill is great progress. But we can do even better. Bring the troops home...war is never the solution.

--ish


[ Parent ]
Sad that you value some lives more than others
and those being the lives of our enemies.

Of course, your viewpoint is shaped by being isolated from violence to a great degree. Perhaps you could meet some of the Taliban someday.

And my "human shields" garbage is not a rationalisation. Im Maquis-style warfare, certain legal protections evaporate

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
yeah without that pesky Hate Crimes Bill there wouldn't have been the IDENTICAL defense spending
bad gays bad gays

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Sheeesh, teh gays already were blamed
for 9/11, Hurricane Katrina, and just about any other "bad" thing that has happened in American in the last...oh, the last 60 years or so.

You people are so pathetic....


[ Parent ]
and Phyliss Shlafly chipped her nail too
OK that one I'll fess up to....LMQAO!

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Did Karl Rove or Thomas Monson write your SCRIPT?


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Just watching
on MSNBC; missed the actual signing.

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."

pwned Pavlov's puppies......pathetic


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


What's that stench?.....a Mormon MOLE


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Brief Biographies of LDS and Utah Film Personalities
    http://www.ldsfilm.com/bio/bio...

peek-a-boo....I see you

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
more war money
while i am glad the hate crimes bill was passed , it came with the continued glut of money for perpetuating the (still) illegal wars and destruction this country are still waging.  good for the one senator that voted against the continued obscene outlay for the u.s. war machine.  overall i echo renwl's basic sentiment in the post here - i am more horrified by the violence and oppression that will continue on a mass scale as a result of the war appropriations act this was attached to.  i don't feel good about making gains at the expense of my fellow humans.  
hardly seems that pointing that out would lead to a conclusion one needed "healing".

folk the war

I'd also note
the bill continues funding the Don't Ask, Don't Tell policy as Obama pressured Rep Alcee Hastings to withdraw an amendment to the bill that would have defunded DADT, effectively killing it until a repeal could be passed or funding restored. Two steps forward, one step back.

[ Parent ]
time to end just kick queers out
Sue - I said that last week and got screamed at for pointing this out. Since hate crimes legislation passed, Log Cabin Republicans claimed that their long-running law suit to end Don't Ask Just Kick the Queers Out -
Log Cabin Republicans v United States - was blocked by Obama's DOJ.
Let's see if more brave gay men and lesbian Americans are discharged and replaced with Felons & Fascists, with this new funding.

[ Parent ]
As the mother of a soldier
and the friend of a number of women whose bodies are in landfills in New Jersey with 9-11 wreckage,

I have no problem at all with funding the legal, and it is legal, engagement with enemies who count success by the number of civilian bodies their actions leave cold and bloody, and whose religios practices enslave women and murder LGBT's

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
We sat by and watched Obama sign our names in blood
I'm just saying how in the world could gay America permit our gov't to attach the Hate Crime Bill to the $680 BILLION budget for ongoing military operations in the middle east. How could we let that happen? How could we permit such a travesty? How HORRIFIC is that? To turn a blind eye to such an inhumane proposition? It's mind boggling.    

having another BUMMER DAY?
Last time you hit a parked car and got a zit on your little forehead....nearly as TRAGIC as being hauled out on a Laramie road tortured pistol whipped and left hanging on a Larmie FENCE.
   http://current.com/items/88819...

btw another G*D DAMN Mormon was the murderer.

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Petey dear
It's clear this thread, this conversation is beyond your scope, sweetheart. We're not talking Mormons, here. We're talking about the mass murder of innocent people and the gay community's role in it---as of today.

That's probably a bit too much for you to comprehend at the moment and that's quite understandable. Why don't you go back over to the other thread where we've been entertaining each other and wait til I finish this conversation? I'll be back soon enough.

Be a sweetie and do that okay?

:)  


[ Parent ]
anytime cupcake
while I wait here's a present
  http://www.pimples.com/
don't say I never gave ya anything...sweetie

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Have you slept through the LAST EIGHT YEARS?
It's not a NEWS FLASH all Americans have been donating to TWO WARS, not just the gay Americans.
Funny you only screech about it when LGBTs finally get the FIRST LGBT National legislation signed into law.

what a coincidence...ya snotty TWINK.

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
No Mormon taxes pay for the wars in Iraq or Afghanistan?....nice trick if you can do it


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Take a sedative and cut the sanctimonious condescension
The defense bill was destined to pass no matter what was attached to it. The only thing that detaching the hate crimes bill would have accomplished is killing the hate crimes bill.

That you would prefer to let transgender people continue to be hunted down and murdered because you find it distasteful to attach the hate crimes measure to a defense bill that was already destined to pass is your prerogative. It is a moral perspective and one worthy of respect. But it is only one point of view, and it is certainly not an obviously correct and completely undebatable viewpoint. Holding that view does not make you morally superior to those of us who happened to think that trying to stop the wholesale slaughter of transgender people was too important to sacrifice for what would have been, in our view, a symbolic and ineffectual protest against the defense bill.

My partner and I have been marching in the streets against war since the winter of 2002-03. So spare me your condescending sanctimony. No one appointed you pope of the gays, empowered to issue binding moral decrees.


[ Parent ]
:D
Thank you.

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...

[ Parent ]
Wow!
Now you know how to debate! And you're right. My perspective is one of view. I've just put it out there. But by no means did I feel that it was thee point of view. And I very much appreciate what you had to say.

I'd like to point out however, that my concerns are not about whether the defense budget would've passed or not. For some reason that matter keeps being brought up. I know defense budget would've passed. And yes, I have great issue with the Hate bill being attached to it.

And I'm sorry: I don't see the wholesale slaughter of civilian on those middle eastern countries as any less horrific than the wholesale slaughter of any other human being---be it transgender or otherwise. All human life is valuable. That's my protest. And to me, that's worth standing up for and clearly being a minority in opinion about this matter.  


[ Parent ]
Our enemies set the rules of engagement
and they set them at success being measured by civilian dead.

So, if civilian populations, villages, towns, house and give comfort to our enemies, they have sacrificed their safety. By our enemies' own rules.

And these same enemies are vehement and murderous opponents of LGBT's.
 

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
Innocent people do not deserve to die
So, if civilian populations, villages, towns, house and give comfort to our enemies, they have sacrificed their safety. By our enemies' own rules.

And these same enemies are vehement and murderous opponents of LGBT's.

I'll repeat what I originally posted because the above statements completely underscores the following:

"The philosopher Theodor Adorno wrote, in words gay activists should have heeded, that exclusive preoccupation with personal concerns and indifference to the suffering of others beyond the self-identified group made fascism and the Holocaust possible."

Lady I rest my case. No matter what your logic. You ought to be ashamed of yourself. It's one thing to accept and support the terms of how the Hate Crime bill was legislated. It's another to justify the extermination of human life. If there's any "enemy" to humanity it's you.


[ Parent ]
innocent people didn't deserve to die
like a gay man helping to down Flight 93, or a gay fire department chaplin, or a lesbian fire fighter who charged INTO the towers.

BTW only the spouses of gays/lesbian had to fight for spousal benefits after 9/11, and Falwell 3 days afterwards blamed gays for the attack.
You have a convenient memory who died

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
So therefore...
What in the world are you talking about Petey? Do you know what you're talking about? Wait. Scratch that. Do you know what day this is in the week? Let's start with the basics.  

[ Parent ]
you're repeating yourself...and 28 is awful early for alzhiemers.....puppy
"The philosopher Theodor Adorno wrote, in words gay activists should have heeded, that exclusive preoccupation with personal concerns and indifference to the suffering of others beyond the self-identified group made fascism and the Holocaust possible."

My generation who fought, sacrificed, and died to bring today's victory...had they seen the sniveling self promoting snarky B-queen model/waiter/actor/writer coming to SPIT on the first NATIONAL signed LGBT law....they wouldn't have BOTHERED.

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
LOL!
You still think I'm that kid you found on Facebook? Priceless.

Who said I spit on the Hate Bill? Of course I'm all for it. Don't be silly. Oh Petey. Petey. Wetey. Detey. You're so cute and feisty.  


[ Parent ]
Dumba$$
You left your website and your email, you combine the name with the website...up pops all your online LIFE, including the Bummer Day video.

Do you deny that's you?

I was born at night, but not LAST night

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
watch and learn
Creative editor Derrick Shore
  http://renwl.org/2009/10/19/re...

that's the website YOU LIST on your profile
plug Derrick Shore to google

   http://www.google.com/search?s...

voila

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
You're hilarious!!!
OMG, you're so off base about my identity. This is hilarious! Okay. Where did you get that name? Derrick Shore? Who is this person? Yes, RENWL is the Web site of which my equality group hosts. That part you got right. But sweetie, I'm not that Derrick. Pam can tell you I'm not that Derrick. Same spelling of the first name. But you're way off with the last name. Not the same person, sweetie. Keep lookin, though:)  

[ Parent ]
de Nile it's not just a river in Egypt


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
since you compared me to a fag hag...er...blog hag and a homeless guy living in an airport
You brought this upon yourself.....puppy

You sure are fishing for info about me and I didn't leave a cookie trail

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
you left a trail too.....uncle fat lips


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
My appology to Derrick Shore
I found a post where renwl identifies himself as Derrick Mathis
  Derrick Mathis
Posted June 30, 2009 at 1:33 AM
Chris,

Thanks man. Keep exposing that douche bag Aravotis. What a pig. I just don't understand why is it that some people-intelligent ones like Aravotis actually thinks that lies and lack of integrity is a good thing when aiming criticism-as if that validates it. It saddens and enrages me that a guy like that is working overtime to keep gays in a "victim" state of mind.

And he knows exactly what he's doing. What a jerk.

Thanks again.

~ Derrick aka renwl

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Now you've got it!
You thought I was lying. I kept telling you, you had the wrong Derrick. But Petey, what makes you think I'm afraid for others to know my identity? As I said and as you discovered I'm all over the place. In addition to being a commentator I'm a writer. I write things---using my real name.

So I'm glad you've finally got the right Derrick for yourself. I'm here:)  


[ Parent ]
Right here too
   

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
The three celebrity hairs you sold on ebay
were they pubes caught in your capped teeth?

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Yes, if they aid our enemies, they place themselves at risk
And further, I am certainly following Adorno's maxim by considering the safety of others and the survival of western civilisation.

I am not blandly justifying the extermination of human life.

I am supporting the adherence to rules of engagement that recognise the reality of civilian support for our enemies, and support rules of engagement that favour the survival of our soldiers/

I dont know what kind of love for country it is that you possess, but I would rather risk the deaths of those aiding and shielding our enemies rather than risk the deaths of our soldiers.

Don't lecture me on morality and politics; I have actually put my life on the line for freedom.

Don't lecture the LGBT community of the morality of politics when we do not get to choose the vehicle of our slow liberation.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
It was attached to the bill
because the Democrats are so weak, they couldn't pass it as a stand alone bill. Nor could they pass it attached to a more mundane, less important tourism bill earlier in the year. As soon as that more was announced, Republicans set about filibustering the bill, so Harry Reid didn't even bother trying.

[ Parent ]
I don't understand
Are you saying that we should have NO bill at all, rather than have one that was attached to the Appropriations bill?

Since we had no say as to where it was attached or presented....


[ Parent ]
No I'm not saying that....
But you speak as though it was a now or never kind of scenario. That's not true. Personally, I would've rather the bill took a little longer to find a proper placement if ultimately it needed to be attached at all.



[ Parent ]
WAIT = NEVER
Yeah what were the odds you wanted Hate Crimes protection to WAIT.
Utah just got a Hate Crimes Bill.....why would that bother you? It's a puzzlement????

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Must not be trans.


http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...

[ Parent ]
Just self loathing queer


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
shhhhh
Petey!  Careful.  People might think we are talking again.

Would wreck the whole status quo ;)

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...


[ Parent ]
it won't happen again


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
I heard/read that! Imagine!


It's the Hammer of JUSTICE,
It's the Bell of FREEDOM,
It's the Song about LOVE between,
my Brothers and my Sisters
...All over this Land.


[ Parent ]
you can check back over a couple weeks dys responding to my posts, and I said NOTHING


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Just how many LGBT dead without justice constitutes acceptable wait?
Because for many of us, not a single death, beating without justice is acceptable now.

We've had enough of the slow genocide of LGBT's, the incessant dripping of victims' blood

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
"I would've rather the bill took a little LONGER"
   http://s810.photobucket.com/al...

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Renwl Get a life....
Go freaking enlist.  I've already served my country and know the military needs money to conduct any operation.  Any operation and that includes withdrawal from a territory.  So STFU with your boo-hoo, I'm mormon but I love Islamics bologna.

That being said, yay on this bill finally going through and serving as a tremendous stepping stone for the rest to follow!

I was a victim of an anti-trans hate crime in Texas.  The assailant got 2 weeks incarceration and I was left with 13k of medical bills (thank god for insurance!!!).  Had this law been enacted prior to that incident then maybe the assailant would have been locked up and not raped that girl a month after his release.  But oh well.  

The future just keeps getting brighter...I gotta say.  =0)


[ Parent ]
It's all about you.
You'll always be victim. Hate crime or no hate crime. You'll find a way. Soldier.  

[ Parent ]
Lol clueless...
Not if I can help it.  And you, good person, are tasteless for even suggesting such a thing.  Sinner repent, for the end is nigh!

=0)


[ Parent ]
Patty, thanks for your service
and I appalled by the way that our lil friend remwl used Soldier as an epithet.

I was a sailor, by the way.
My son is a soldier.
Hooooah

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
It's the only reason it passed
They did that because the other option was to not have it pass.

The defense bill was going to pass anyway.


[ Parent ]
Not about whether the defense bill was going to pass or not.
We could've waited for another opportunity. The Hate Crime Bill did not have to be attached to the defense bill. That's just not true.  

[ Parent ]
we got your number


What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Petey please...
Can't you contribute something intelligent to the conversation? If you keep this up I'm going to start ignoring you. I promise.  

[ Parent ]
that'd break my aging heart
You stand on the shoulders on MY generation and I've been around twice as long as you.

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
I'll add THIS
  http://www.ichatgay.com/img_bl...

trump that twink

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
Why should we wait? The enemies of our country are our enemies too
Why should we wait another day?
What moral qualms are there that we ought to be afraid of/

None.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
Not very horrific.
THe defense bill does indeed pay for the war on terror.

It pays for the salaries of the families of those soldiers, it pays for the equipment and supplies needed to arm them, clothe them, feed them, care for them.  It pays for the treatment of illness of veterans who are not in combat, it pays for the defense contractors engaged in making sure schools and libraries stay open on bases, it pays to do a hell of a lot more then merely kill other human beings, who, in the end, are a relatively small part of the whole, and it's disingenuous to reduce it to such a small portion of the whole.

Then again, I'm not the usual anti-military sort that would reduce it to such, having served myself -- this girl is proud to have been a Ranger.

The bill isn't all that inhumane, and in saying it is, you describe me as inhumane.

Good luck substantiating that one.

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...


[ Parent ]
Protecting My Lifeq
I was totally and completely against the illegal invastion of Iraq, and am glad to see the moves we have made, through the Obama administration, to draw down our military presence there and concentrate on protecting US assets in the country. We need the money in this bill to continue that effort.

That being said, I cannot and will not call the war in Afghanistan illegal. I was in DC on 9/11, just 7 blocks from the White House. I remember all too well the terror of knowing there was another airplane out there that was due to destroy some part of my city. I remember trying to mentally calculate the debris pattern were the White House hit and whether I would be in danger.

We painfully neglected the war in Afghanistan for too long and the men who threatened my life on that day are still mainly at large. I am not happy where we are in that military conflict right now, but have to blame Bush for that quagmire. I hope that Obama is able to find a way out without collapsing the already fragile government, but only time will tell (I'd be approaching the major Muslim powers about a peacekeeping force, but I don't live in the White House).

As a gay man, I am fine with the way this law was finally passed - that's politics.  


[ Parent ]
**salutes Dyss**
This money also funds the USNS Mercy and the USNS Comfort as they travel the globe providing medical care and comfort to impoverished people. It will provide funding for the ships and helicopters transporting Humanitarian Aid and Disaster Assistance to places such as the Philippines and India after tsunamis and floods decimate the countryside.

This bill provides funding to the U.S. Military HIV Research Program, which is the largest medical research organization in the U.S. dedicated to finding a vaccine for HIV, and for distributing treament drugs to countries receiving aid under PEPFAR.

It's keeping me employed working on intelligence-sharing projects which have prevented dirty bombs from reaching California.

It's keeping my Beloved in uniform, working within her own MOS. It will take her away from me very soon.

And this Hate Crimes enhancement will also help protect troops who are victims of anti-gay or anti-trans hate crimes based on their real or perceived sexual orientation or gender identity. There are many of us.

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi


[ Parent ]
Joe Solmonese...
Every time I see that name, I literally want to SCREAM.

Girl SCREAM---SCREAM!
There's quite a few folks out there the same about you. I'm sure you know this,  

My bad.
I thought you were Joe Solmonese...LOL!!!

[ Parent ]
2 presents
  http://rlv.zcache.com/pull_up_...

What have you done today, to make ya feel PROUD?


~Heather Small


[ Parent ]
At last, at long last
Thanks the heavens, its happened at last.

Now to get the rest done...

http://www.dyssonance.com  Breaking all the rules...


My thoughts,
The fact that the defense bill would have passed anyway, in a form unaffected by whether or not hate crimes was attached, si enough for me to celebrate this victory with low-dose guilt. I do agree with renewl that it would have been preferable had it not been attached to the war spending bill. Then again, I take dyssonance's testimony - that the money in the bill goes helping and protecting humans in war, even if it also goes towards killing - seriously. I do hope those dollars go a long way to helping and protectin those we have there.

But we have firmly established that the defense bill would have passed, in its same form, hate crimes or no. Renewl has conceded this. That the hate crimes bill's absense would have NO EFFECT on whether or not the defense bill happened firmly rebuts the notion that today's victory "caused" the war spending to go on.

Renewl's "we could have waited" MAY be true. I'm not sure who has evidence. We DO have evidence that the hate crime bill was fought against every step of the way, and the hard earned victories - the elections, the citizens (including transgender citizens) visiting their Congressfolk, the donations solicited in hard times, the YEARS OF WAITING WE ALREADY DID, the media campains, tv debates, GLAAD vigilance, etc, etc - these hard earned victories were NOT the stuff that could be wished into existence so we could "wait longer". We took what we could.

And remember, NO EFFECT on defense bill.    


[ Parent ]
Mixed reaction
My gut feeling, as a civil libertarian, is that instead of passing hate crimes laws (which in my view are kind of questionable, as they punish based on motivation rather than on action), we ought to make sure that the laws we already have on the books regarding assault, murder, rape, etc., are enforced.
On the other hand, I know that very frequently they're not, and so I can see the value of having laws like this as a sort of in-between measure to make sure that people who commit hate crimes don't get a slap on the wrist.
On the other other hand (apparently I'm Zaphod Beeblebrox now), it seems utterly clear that if we're going to have any hate crimes laws at all, we damn well better have them protecting the LGBTQ community. So I would say that, although I'm not thrilled about hate crimes legislation as a concept, this one is clearly called for if the concept exists at all.

Trans and proud, albeit closeted.

Anne
There are more than enough examples of sheriffs, prosecutors, and juries who let off murderes, and people who seriously assault not only TLBGs, but any minority they can lay their hands on, for the specific reason of "blaming the victim".

Read up on the "gay panic" and "trans panic" defense, and see how many people get off either scott free, or with a slap on the wrist.

Hate crimes sends a signal to those who would think they could kill a fag, or beat up a chink or gook, and because they know ol' Bubba the local sheriff they won't be put in jail, but a pat on the back for keep their town free of "them kind".

Why are so many of us in the trans community choosing "stealth"? Because they're afraid of being beaten up on the street, or discriminated on the job, mainly, and I don't blame those in stealth for it.

But when you see a gang of kids kicking the hell out of some poor gay kid, saying "kill the faggot" -- THAT'S A HATE CRIME!

Listen to "TransTalk" every Thursday at 4-5pm ET on http://www.falconradio.org


[ Parent ]
Hung up on how the hate crimes bill was passed?
Not one dime was appropriated for any war (or any thing) in the recently signed Defense Authorization bill.

There are authorization bills, and then there are appropriations bills.

If you're hung up on the technicality of passing a bill by amending it to another bill you don't like, then comfort yourself in the technicality that no money was in the bill the hate crimes legislation was attached to.

Authorizing legislation:  A bill that creates a new federal program, extends the life of an existing program, or repeals existing law. Authorizing bills usually set a limit on the amount of funds that can be spent annually by a program over a period of three to five years. But it's important to remember that an authorizing bill only establishes the framework for a federal program - it does not provide funds to operate the program.

Appropriations bill:  A bill that allocates funding for specific federal programs.  Unlike authorizing legislation, which remains in effect for three or more years, an appropriations bill must be enacted into law every year. Each year, in fact, Congress must pass a series of 13 appropriations bills to keep federal departments and agencies operating.



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