Faith-Based Initiatives: Once Burned, Twice Shy

I am adamantly opposed to any "faith-based initiatives". . .

I don't think my tax dollars should be spent as incentives for any "religious" group to engage in a project they've selected to do "good works." No church should become dependent upon the government for the funding to engage in charity efforts - and the potential for abuse and political favoritism in these efforts isn't worth the potentially bad feelings among competing "religious" organizations for government grants.

Moreover, I am already sick and tired of listening to both candidates (and the media) yapping constantly about the religious connections of candidates. Has anyone noticed there are at least 20 million confirmed adult atheists in this country? Who is going to represent THEIR interests in the White House?

Now I'm not dissing churches here who do good works, which I assume is part of their teaching and their faith. However, they are not the only organizations which do good works in this country, and I don't like the government basing eligibility on the establishment of a "church." We all know some "churches" are little more than political action committees - I would imagine their names are so well-known in a locality (along with their rabid anti-gay attitudes) that even with government strings attached, how many gay people are going to be willing to approach them for help - even if they aren't allowed to discriminate?

The government - and my tax dollars - does not belong in the pockets of anyone's church.  

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by: kevinbgoode @ Fri Jul 11, 2008 at 22:44:31 PM CDT

I am with you on this

  Faith based programs would head right to the chopping block, ASAP

If I make sense? it was quite by accident.

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by: HappyCat @ Fri Jul 11, 2008 at 23:34:49 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

It's not enought to remember Bette Davis' advice to "Fasten your seatbelts, it's going to be a bumpy night (campaign)."

 
'The Los Angeles Times:

"As Barack Obama moves to broaden his appeal beyond loyal Democrats, a chorus of anger and disappointment has arisen from the left. But those voices are a distinct minority because the party has a more pressing concern: winning in November."

http://www.latimes.com/news/po...

Obama has begun the traditional Democratic election dance - the Allemande Right. He's lurching to the right. He has a lot further to go on the path trail blazed by Clinton, Gore and Kerry.

When Obama started out he masqueraded as an 'independent', vaguely left candidate who'd repair the damage caused by eight years of Bush. He reveled in the fact that he didn't have a history of sellouts and betrayals like Hillary. In his book the Audacity of Hope he boasted that

"I am new enough on the national political scene that I serve as a blank screen on which people of vastly different political stripes project their own views."

His lack of a record fooled lots of people and got him the nomination.

And now he's repeating the pattern that gave the last two elections to Bush on a silver platter. Even so revulsion with Bush is so deep that Obama could still win as a right-centrist candidate. The unbelievably slimy politics of Gore and Kerry, following Bill Clinton's betrayals of labor (NAFTA), ourselves (DOMA and DADT) and everyone else to the right of Pat Robertson drove millions away from the voting booth.

Obama read the polls and found out that superstitious (religious) groups can deliver votes so he supports funneling federal funds through bigot groups, just like Hillary Clinton, Bush and McCain.

The Democratic Party leadership, as distinguished from those who mistakenly vote for it, has long been indistinguishable from the Republican Party in terms of actual practice, and nothing else, certainly not candidates promises counts. They are the twin parties of war, bigotry and economic chaos.  

For all those who were taken in by Obama's lies it's not enough to follow Bette Davis' advice to "Fasten your seatbelts, it's going to be a bumpy night." You're going to need nose plugs and anti nausea drugs to get past the rightwing stench and vote for Obama. If elected he'll be another Clinton: not just a worthless friend, an enemy.

The looter rich much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons - they're greedier, they fool more people and they're able to get away with a lot more than Republicans.  

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by: donal1944 @ Fri Jul 11, 2008 at 23:47:52 PM CDT

you either trust Obama or you don't

I reserve judgement on how he executes these progams, but for now he has my trust, and I hope he values the faith people have in him.

"race, taste. and History finally overcome....and you ain't there"
by Tony Kushner

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by: peteyPornpig @ Fri Jul 11, 2008 at 23:49:06 PM CDT

I don't exactly DIStrust Obama

But I can't say I trust him, either. How about... I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même merde.

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by: TechBear @ Fri Jul 11, 2008 at 23:58:37 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The third Clinton administration

Just without a Clinton in the White House. It will be Deja Vue all over again, rethugs claiming he is an unholy cross between Joe Stalin & Chairman Mao while he enacts their policies.

Say hello to the new boss same as the old boss.  

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by: Natasha Yar-Routh @ Sat Jul 12, 2008 at 01:59:23 AM CDT

Assuming he's elected...

By trying to please the right who isn't going to vote for him anyway, he's managed to displease much of the left.

I'm not at all sure he can win this thing now.

His FISA vote alone shows he's willing to burn the constitution.  Many on the left are bone-tired of 8 years of Bush doing just that, and are now just leaving politics and voting behind in utter disgust that a Dem candidate would trade the 4th amendment for a handful of votes.

Remember, the last few elections have been nearly 50/50.  The R's are pushing their sheeple hard and are going to get out every last vote they can.  And, we had half the votes last time too -- but now we have a Dem candidate who is trying to push Republican ideals, FISA, Faith-based, No late-term abortions, and many other PURELY Conservative Republican ideas.  I don't think a lot of people on the left who really have come to care about these things in the last 8 years are going to be excited about voting for more of the same.  I see change, only none of it is in the right direction with Obama, in fact, I see expansion of faith-based, greater warantless wiretapping, more restrictions on abortion, more years in Iraq and Afghanistan, and possibly Iran, and the list goes on.  If you examine his proposals carefully, it seems like he's desperately trying to outBush Bush.  Sigh...

I think we are truly, very, very screwed.  Even if we win, we still lose.  And, I hardly trust Obama who has arrived at all those illogical conclusions to make good judgments when it comes to Supreme Court justices...  In fact, I hardly think it matters who we vote for this year, or even if we vote.  It seems like a false choice to me.

I think we will see low turnout for Democratic voters, and I know that I'm going against what everyone else on the planet is saying...  Time will tell...  

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by: Storm @ Sat Jul 12, 2008 at 02:18:30 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Obama has given us a commitment

but McCain on the other hand runs and hides whenever LGBT issues come up. He would never sign anything.  

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by: kcflood @ Sat Jul 12, 2008 at 07:13:41 AM CDT

see McCAIN firing ALABAMA campaign chair... for possibility.

Well more than possibility...for being accused by his wife of having sex with a man!

Imagine... had to be fired and expunged from all records.  There's your McCain support folks, see thread above. 

It's the Hammer of JUSTICE,
It's the Bell of FREEDOM,
It's the Song about LOVE between,
my Brothers and my Sisters
...All over this Land.

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by: Orion45 @ Sat Jul 12, 2008 at 11:29:10 AM CDT

[ Parent ]