'Christian' of the day - Ohio

I hate this...

Ohio law defines "Sexual Imposition" as:

(A) No person shall have sexual contact with another, not the spouse of the offender; cause another, not the spouse of the offender, to have sexual contact with the offender; or cause two or more other persons to have sexual contact when any of the following applies:

(1) The offender knows that the sexual contact is offensive to the other person, or one of the other persons, or is reckless in that regard.

(2) The offender knows that the other person's, or one of the other person's, ability to appraise the nature of or control the offender's or touching person's conduct is substantially impaired.

(3) The offender knows that the other person, or one of the other persons, submits because of being unaware of the sexual contact.

(4) The other person, or one of the other persons, is thirteen years of age or older but less than sixteen years of age, whether or not the offender knows the age of such person, and the offender is at least eighteen years of age and four or more years older than such other person.

(5) The offender is a mental health professional, the other person or one of the other persons is a mental health client or patient of the offender, and the offender induces the other person who is the client or patient to submit by falsely representing to the other person who is the client or patient that the sexual contact is necessary for mental health treatment purposes.

I wonder which part of that statute this man actually violated.

Regardless, I look forward to hearing about the sting operations in parking lots around the local universities and college bars. Surely, this epidemic of "stimulating the genitals" must be out-of-control in traditionally straight cruising areas. Before the weather turned cold, I saw a pretty brazen straight couple engaged in exactly that behavior while parked in the Burnett Woods adjacent to Cincinnati University. And don't get me started on what I saw in the parking lot after my last trip to the movies! I demand Cincinnati PD do something about it.

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by: jerekeys @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 05:34:18 AM CST

Gay?

Pam, I also question your phrase "spending taxpayer dollars busting gay men cruising for sex." Not to start a big debate about labels, but I'm pretty sure Williams identifies as straight, and may even be married. Calling him a gay man for seeking out gay sex is misleading and fuels the sort of paranoia that drives these sting operations. Out, open gay men who embrace both the label and the community are not--generally speaking--the people getting caught by police for trolling the parks for anonymous sex.

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by: jerekeys @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 05:40:46 AM CST

we get into this roundabout discussion

whenever there is a post of this nature. Most of these men are trolling for gay sex and are either gay or bi, and in many cases 1) feel they cannot be who they are openly, or 2) are in open relationships (though it's hard to imagine a wife being ok with her husband cruising for anonymous, possibly unprotected sex and then coming home to sleep with her); or 3) are gay/bi and want the benefits of public heterosexual privilege via marriage and cruise for sexual pleasure. There is no paranoia being filled here -- the men are indeed there to participate in consensual same-sex acts, it's in a public place where it shouldn't be occurring, and the police are unfairly targeting places known for gay cruising and not heterosexual haunts. All of those things are true.

These threads usually erupt with strong opinions over the selective intended persecution of gays with these stings  and the pros/cons of public gay sex, so I won't be surprised if we see the same kind of discussion again.

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by: Pam Spaulding @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 06:39:50 AM CST

[ Parent ]

I agree Pam ...

... since its specifically targeting gay men as opposed to straight couples who get freaky in public just as much [wish I had some stats], then we have to call it what it is.  

Jerekeys seems to be right about one thing: out gay men don't seem to be the ones caught in these sort of things.  I don't think its because they don't like "the hunt" or understand its appeal -- maybe they're just smarter about it.  I don't know.  Maybe these guys only make news because of their hypocrisy.  

Whatever.  But calling it 'tax-payer dollars used for busting gay men cruising for sex' is dead on.  

Can LOVE ever be a sin?

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by: TaylorSiluwe @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 07:02:00 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Defining terms

It gets convoluted, but I make a distinction between homosexual activity and being Gay. You can bet this man, like Ted Haggard or Larry Craig, does not self-identify as gay, has very likely spoken out publicly against gays, and may even have worked against gay rights. Like most men caught in these stings he identifies as "straight" and is unlikely to change that. In fact it's likely there will be an announcement soon he has entered a Christian "reparative therapy" group as Haggard did.

The problem comes when the media says gay men are cruising for hookups in bathrooms, parks, and other public places when in fact most of the participants don't identify as gay and may very well be opposed to gay rights. We just get blamed for it. There may be a large homosexual component to these men's sexual makeup but to me at least "gay" is part of an identity, not just sexual activity. The two words are not interchangeable.

For what it's worth, I live in a conservative state, one usually dismissed as "fly-over country" and I have seen many of these stings reported in the local papers. In fact one of our area papers made some national news and gay blogs because they not only print the names but the home addresses and booking photos of the offenders when they don't do that for other crimes. A man committed suicide last year and another man who claims he was merely using the restroom (umm, whatever) lost his job and his wife suffered a heart attack. Almost without exception when one of these stings is reported those caught are married. These are men who won't even go to one of the many internet gay hookup sites to look for sex because that would require more honesty with themselves than they are capable. The public sees these events as "those nasty gays being skeevy in public" when the participants would never admit to being part of the gay community and probably never will.

It's a fine distinction but one I think needs to be made.

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by: Codswallop @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 09:34:42 AM CST

Defining terms

It gets convoluted, but I make a distinction between homosexual activity and being Gay. You can bet this man, like Ted Haggard or Larry Craig, does not self-identify as gay, has very likely spoken out publicly against gays, and may even have worked against gay rights. Like most men caught in these stings he identifies as "straight" and is unlikely to change that. In fact it's likely there will be an announcement soon he has entered a Christian "reparative therapy" group as Haggard did.

The problem comes when the media says gay men are cruising for hookups in bathrooms, parks, and other public places when in fact most of the participants don't identify as gay and may very well be opposed to gay rights. We just get blamed for it. There may be a large homosexual component to these men's sexual makeup but to me at least "gay" is part of an identity, not just sexual activity. The two words are not interchangeable.

For what it's worth, I live in a conservative state, one usually dismissed as "fly-over country" and I have seen many of these stings reported in the local papers. In fact one of our area papers made some national news and gay blogs because they not only print the names but the home addresses and booking photos of the offenders when they don't do that for other crimes. A man committed suicide last year and another man who claims he was merely using the restroom (umm, whatever) lost his job and his wife suffered a heart attack. Almost without exception when one of these stings is reported those caught are married. These are men who won't even go to one of the many internet gay hookup sites to look for sex because that would require more honesty with themselves than they are capable. The public sees these events as "those nasty gays being skeevy in public" when the participants would never admit to being part of the gay community and probably never will.

It's a fine distinction but one I think needs to be made.

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by: Codswallop @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 09:44:46 AM CST

Sexual Imposition

It makes you wonder what the next step would be.

"Sexual exposition"?


"In order to maintain an untenable position, you have to be actively ignorant."  The Colbert Report

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by: Lev Raphael @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 10:04:34 AM CST

Laws

What bugs me about these stings - typically guys get arrested just for trying to pick up the undercover officers - not for actually engaging in anything sexual.  That's so ridiculous.  Asking someone for sex or trying to "pick them up" - wherever that may be - isn't really against the law.  And from the sounds of this report the guy groped the officer - I assume after the officer invited him into his car.  Is touching someone's crotch in the car really against the law if Willy doesn't actually make an appearance?

This is nothing but entrapment, pure and simple.  I hope the guy gets a good lawyer and fights it.  When policeman start realizing they can't make these charges stick, they'll cut down on them.  The problem is that all these closeted men are so ashamed and scared, they'll just roll over and take it up the ass - pun intended.  A good lawyer would chew this police force up.

That said, right or wrong - a lot of "GAY" guys, out and all, still cruise parks.  It's not always the closeted ones, so we can't blame it all on them.  Again though, I don't really think that "cruising" is wrong - every man, straight or gay, does it all day long, every day - but it's only having actual sex in public places that should be curtailed.  (Though it is kind of hot)

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by: pt90048 @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 17:09:38 PM CST

Arrest most men,

 I agree this is entrapment.  I could understand if the cop was under 18. I could agree if the sting was to prevent adults from harming children.  But this is an adult male looking for sex with another adult male.

I have guys that try to pick me up looking for sex.  I have flirted with guys looking for a bit of fun.  But if the target is men looking for sex, arrest most of them.

If I make sense? it was quite by accident.

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by: HappyCat @ Wed Dec 03, 2008 at 19:29:05 PM CST

[ Parent ]