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Newt converts to Catholicism - conservative says his 'sins no longer exist'

by: Pam Spaulding

Mon Mar 30, 2009 at 09:00:00 AM EDT


Nice try, guys. I know the 2012 slate looks a bit weak but this is an epic FAIL, with a hypocrisy meter-explosion cherry on top.
[O]n Sunday, March 29, Gingrich will have converted to Catholicism, the faith of his third wife, Calista Bisek. Though the ceremony was announced without fanfare, leading Catholic conservatives like Deal Hudson are brimming with excitement. Hudson was the most important Catholic political advisor to President Bush and Karl Rove, founder of the seminal Catholic journal, Crisis magazine, and self-described "theocon," contends that Gingrich's conversion represents more than a concession to his wife; it signals a dramatic break from the past, both personally and politically.

"From a Catholic point of view," Hudson told me, "Newt's sins no longer exist-they've been absolved. He's made a fresh start in life. So Newt will continue to sin and confess but there aren't going to be a lot of Catholics who will hold that against him. They understand why being a Catholic makes a difference."

Hudson said that while many of his friends are "extremely close" to Gingrich, he and the former Speaker of the House are just friendly acquaintances. But Hudson explains that he relates to Gingrich's experience on a deeply personal level. Like Gingrich, he is a convert and a thrice-married sinner engaged continually in confession and absolution.

Raised as a Southern Baptist, Hudson converted to Catholicism at age 34 after becoming enraptured by the writings of St. Thomas Aquinas. Upon receiving communion, Hudson received an annulment from his first wife, then divorced his second wife four years later. "It's not unusual to do that in this day and age," Hudson reflected, "so that sort of angle that Chris Buckley is taking to make fun of Newt is unfair."

You mean to tell me these GOP adulterers would give a thrice-married booty call Democrat the same slack? Please. Hudson's one to be pious. In Max Blumenthal's piece in the Daily Beast, it's no wonder he's cutting the Contract With America serial adulterer some slack.
In 1994, after a night of drinking games at a West Village pub, during which he allegedly made out with two female students and took "body shots" with them, Hudson brought an extremely intoxicated 18-year-old student named Cara Poppas back to his office and compelled her to perform oral sex on him. When the student told school authorities about the incident, Hudson promptly resigned and moved to Washington to edit Crisis. Two years later, Hudson settled a sexual harassment lawsuit out of court with Poppas for $30,000.
Afterwards, Hudson had no problem scorching Bill Clinton for his oral indulgences.
"Over and over again, we hear on the talk shows that we shouldn't hold the president to a 'higher standard,'" Hudson wrote in 1996. "I would argue quite the opposite... Those who are not willing to bear the burden of these higher standards should not seek office... After we have stripped away all idealism from offices that bind our culture together - president, father, husband - what will be left for us to aspire to? Who will want to sacrifice personal desires for public responsibilities?"
I love it. Since they cannot survive the hypocrisy challenge, conservatives in 2009 just use religion to clean the slate for themselves. It's just too much.

Related:
* Newt blames VA massacre on 'liberalism'
* Thrice-married Newt Gingrich: Brave Champion of Proposition 8:

Pam Spaulding :: Newt converts to Catholicism - conservative says his 'sins no longer exist'
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throwing stones
is this really news? really  

throwing stones II
really, this is how this starts. How about we go back to a time when people's pvt life was just that for the most part... pvt. John Edwards rings a bell and then we can keep going back and forth or just relax, chill out and hope for the best, esp for the Edwards family. Really after Bristol Palin I dont see the point anymore. Attack on policy for the most part.

hipocrisy
That would be fine, except the policy he promotes is in direct contrast to the life he has lived.  When he declares that we are not worthy of civil rights because of how we live our lives, his life comes directly into question.

[ Parent ]
Oh bullsh*t.
Comparing Newt Gringrich to Bristol Palin is lame at best and offensive at worst.

What an obviously disingenuous argument.

FAIL.  

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[ Parent ]
Just makes Catholicism even more sour
This is a nice addition to the Catholic kettle.  Kinda like dropping a pair of dirty sweat socks to the fish stew.

I wonder if the Catholic Church will be forced - forced! - to recognize Newty's previous marriages.  Catholicism is opposed to divorce, let alone remarriage.  Christians scared idiot Californians into thinking that their corrupt and bigoted churches would be forced - forced! - into accepting the gays unless marriage was protected from them.  

Does this mean that the church has been forced - forced! - into accepting divorced men that have been remarried multiple times?  Oh no...white straight men are absolved...I get it.  Privilege.  

Marriage certainly does need protection...from different sex couples...and the Catholick church.


The Catholic Church
will say that the first two marriages were not true marriages in the church because they were not performed/blessed by a priest. In fact, if the third marriage is not blessed, they may not recognize that one either. The Church manages to get around that "no divorce" rule quite nicely. I had a cousin who was married for several years, had a child with his wife, divorced her, wanted to marry another woman and somehow got an "annulment" from the church and was able to do so. Both marriages were performed in the Catholic Church.

[ Parent ]
Holy Mother Church annulled
Rurdy Giuliani's first marriage--which lasted for years and produced multiple children--with the surprising announcement that it was never consummated.  It's remarkable how eager the Catholic hierarchy is to cut slack for men who are powerful/influential.  And I use the word men deliberately here.  If there is a case of a church permitting a woman to annul her husband, I'm not aware of it.  (I'm sure it must have happened at some point, for some queen or duchess or whoever.  But this ex-Catholic isn't aware of any such instances, and I follow the church's assorted villainies fairly closely.  Such cases, if they happened, are the very rare exception.  Do you think they'd let Nancy Pelosi annul her husband?)

Cynic, n.  A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be.  
-Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary


[ Parent ]
Under Canon Law there are other grounds for Annulment
There are numerous "impediments" to marriage that permit annulment, including:

* Consanguinity
* Psychological state precluding ability to consent
* No intention, when marrying, to remain faithful to the spouse (simulation of consent)
* No intention, when marrying, to have children
* Deception of one party by the other in order to obtain consent, and if the partner had been aware of the truth, would not have consented to marry
* Abduction with the intent to compel marriage (known as raptus), constitutes an impediment as long as he/she remains in the kidnapper's power. (The abduction of a man constitutes an impediment in the Eastern Church but not in the Latin church.)
* Failure to adhere to requirements of canon law for marriages, such as clandestinity
* Impediment of Crime, bringing about physically (or through moral cooperation) the death of one's own spouse or the spouse of another, with the intention of marriage
* Undispensed lack of form

There are several possible grounds for the Giuliani annulment, perhaps one of these would have been the case:
- no intention (by Rudy) to remain faithful; or
- deception (by Rudy) - for example, his wife may not have known of his identity as a "drag queen" and might not have consented to marriage had she known.

MANY Annulments are granted where the petitioner is the (former) wife.  The most common ground used today is "Psychological state precluding ability to consent" - there are canon lawyers who believe that any Catholic marriage could conceivably be annuled on this basis.  It is also the most likely reason for the Giuliani annulment, since it's the closest thing to a "no fault" ground.

If we are going to be critical of the Catholic church, it's best to keep to the things they really do wrong.


[ Parent ]
Lots of hoops
So Pope, Inc can find ways to work with the laws of secular society when the church isn't too wrapped up in bigotry.

In our case, the opportunity to whip believers and political allies into a frenzy against equality is just too tempting to back off from.

The Catholicks have much more to gain by oppressing us and squirming around divorce laws than they would gain by making as many accommodations for us (or to ignore us altogether) as they did for the divorced.  

It sounds so moral, doesn't it?


[ Parent ]
Wait, let me be sure I have this right
So, the Catholic Church only SAYS that they're against divorce, but in reality they'll bend the rules and psychology to accomodate whichever rich guy will pay them to do so?

Kind of like how they claim that children are sacred and so birth control is evil, but they protect the pedophile priests who harm children, rather than putting a millstone around their neck and dropping them in the ocean per Matthew 18:6?

God save ornery old queens! - kevinchi


[ Parent ]
Great quote Keori
That was the best remark made that day.  

[ Parent ]
The cost of a Roman Catholic annulment
In the Archdiocese of New York, an annulment will typically cost $750.00 - when one considers that this is a church tribunal, similar to a secular court, the cost is rather inexpensive compared to a typical divorce.  

The canon law regarding annulments is the way the Catholic Church paints its way out of the corner it painted itself into based on its misinterpretation of the Biblical phrase "What God has put together, let no man set aside" in relation to marriage.

Jesus was talking about the informal method of divorce common in Judaea at the time, still in use in Arab cultures, in which the husband (and only the husband) accomplishes a divorce without any grounds whatsoever, by merely stating "I divorce you" three times to the wife.  This is often devastating to the wife - for example, the situation in Iran for divorced women is terrible.  They are often not taken back by their own families, and sometimes have to eke out an existence by an expedient (under the Iranian version of Shariah) similar to prostitution - where a man who doesn't have 4 wives can get a cleric to issue a marriage license good for a day or a weekend, during which he enjoys relations with the woman, leaves her a gift, and at the end of the period, "divorces" her - this is an expedient somewhat better than being stoned for adultery . . . )

Protestants usually get this interpretation right, and permit divorce.  The Catholic Church "liberalized" canon law for the purpose of treating divorced Catholics with compassion that it does not (yet) offer to LGBT Catholics.  It does hold out hope for the Church in the future, with regard to LGBT issues, that the Church might find some creative way to back itself out of the corner it has created.


[ Parent ]
It was widely reported at the time
that Holy Mother Church found that Rudy's marriage had not been consummated. There was fairly wide outrage at this in NYC, because it made his children into bastards.  I have no reason to doubt the accuracy of the reports.  If you have info to the contrary, I'd love to see it.

This has always been common practice in the church. going back at least as far as the twelfth century.  Eleanor of Aquitane's marriage to King Louis of France was annulled on grounds that they had never consummated the union, even though she had borne him several daughters.

Cynic, n.  A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be.  
-Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary


[ Parent ]
One minor point
I think Eleanor's marriage was dissolved based upon consanguinity (blood relationship.) Eleanor and Louis were cousins, and they were allowed to marry, but then permitted an annulment due to consanguinity. Another issue in play is that Eleanor had failed to bear Louis any sons, and the irony is that when Eleanor married Henry II, she bore him a number of sons. The modern treatment of annulment is that it doesn't affect the legitimacy of the children under canon or civil law. This would have been a more important issue in the days when inheritances would have turned on the issue, but isn't as important now.

[ Parent ]
I'm Not Sure
How does anyone in the GOP think Newt converting to Catholicism is going to work with the protestant fundies? I know that most protestant fundies like the Southern Baptist think that Catholics are not true Christian. I can remember very clearly my Baptist preacher telling me in our Sunday School class for new members that Catholics were not Christian and would be going to Hell. The GOP base are mostly people like my old pastor.

confession, repetentance, and absolution
This is hogwash. Even in RC doctrine, there is no magical "get out of jail free". I'm waiting for Newt to acknowledge his transgressions, and outline a program of atonement therefore.

Catholic doctrine is beside the point.
What matters is Catholic practice--which is to kowtow to every powerful man who's willing to play ball with them.  Catholic doctrine condemns capital punishment, for instance, and the church has declared the Iraq War to be unjust and therefore gravely sinful.  But did you ever hear church leaders condemn George Bush?  

Holy Mother Church has never for one moment permitted doctrinal matters to interfere with their tireless pursuit of money and influence.

Cynic, n.  A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be.  
-Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary


[ Parent ]
(Well, to be fair, George Bush wasn't ever Catholic, either.)
(Given that the man wasn't ever Catholic one could make the argument that for the Pope to speak truth to power would have been impolitic.......  

Giggle.............)


[ Parent ]
Oh please.
Yes, it is news. For one, these hypocrites will LEGISLATE their "morality" and impose it on everyone else - even though they themselves can't even live up to it. They are content to impose on everyone else's private lives. They need to be called out on their hypocrisy.

Newt's just copying John Giles,
the former head of the Christian Coalition of Alabama.  John also converted, which didn't make his fundie Protestant base very happy.  He resigned from his position a few years ago amid much fanfare about how the national CC had become too liberal (!) and he would start a new organization for the true believers.  He hasn't been heard from since.

May Newt's conversion be just as sincere as Giles' (and I'm not snarking here -- I think Giles' conversion was real) and may it have the same effect on his public influence.

"If the apocalypse comes... beep me." -- Buffy Summers


Now Pam, I'm sure his conversion is just as sincere
The answer is yes, BTW.
The Roman Catholic Church does not recognize marriages that do not have a Roman Catholic sacramental character.  Thus the Catholic who marries in a civil ceremony and divorces civilly has no impediment to a Catholic Church wedding.  A non-Catholic with a series of civil weddings and divorces who then marries a Catholic in a Catholic ceremony, would have a problem (requiring an annulment), regardless of conversion, after a divorce from the Catholic spouse.

In conversion cases, the Church could conceivably permit a still-married (in a non-Catholic marriage - the Church does allow non-Catholics to marry Catholics in the Church, provided the non-Catholic promises tor aise all children as Catholic) convert to marry a Catholic in the Church even without a divorce from a recalcitrant pagan or protestant spouse.

Further, the Church would happily welcome a Democrat in Newt's position.

Newt is merely following the example of that misogynistic transphobic hypocrite Augustine of Hippo.  Unless this is a merely political conversion, Newt's zeal as a conservative Catholic should exceed that of most cradle Catholics of the conservative persuasion, perhaps exceeding the evil spouted by fellow conservative Antonin Scalia. Newt is one of the brighter individuals ensnared in the evil of conservative Catholic moral theological immorality.


This is from
the Onion, right? Bobbi Batista's first story, maybe?

OMG... hilarious.  

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"Statute of Limitations" on sins?
Really? The Catholic Church got an amendment on sin passed by God?

I guess so...

From Seacoast (NH) online:

N.H. bishop to consider listing some priest's names

March 30, 2009 9:16 AM

MANCHESTER, N.H. (AP) - The leader of the Catholic Church in New Hampshire has told the founder of a group that tracks reports of clergy sexual abuse that he'll consider posting names of some accused priests.

The conversation between Bishop John McCormack and Terry McKiernan of BishopAccountability.org happened after a Sunday Mass in Manchester while McCormack was greeting parishioners in the church hall, the New Hampshire Union-Leader reports.

McCormack said he would think about the diocese listing the names of priests who have been defrocked or assigned to prayer and penance, and are no longer active in the ministry.

Last week, BishopAccountability.org called for eliminating the statute of limitations on sex-abuse cases after files released by the attorney general's office included the names of 26 newly accused clergy members. Most of the alleged abuse took place decades ago.



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I hope he's planning to publish them online.
Listing them in print media would never work.  There could never be enough ink.

Cynic, n.  A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be.  
-Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary


[ Parent ]
proof that religion/faith is a choice
and does not merit any basis of protections under the law, if one believes similarly of sexual orientation.

What of the massacres done in the name of conservativism
Does The EYE OF NEWT, not remember the Knoxville shootings ?  I suppose that is the liberals fault as well .. never mind this jerk having books by Hannity,Oreally?,rush, NEWT, and others he was driven to murder by their words of hate of liberals.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...



Pain is Inevitable .
Suffering is Optional  


Democratic politicians dont fare so well with the annullment tribunals
then Represenataive Joseph Kennedy had his annullment reversed by the Roman Rata

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

Cut out the middle man
Don't do the sin in the first place.

;)

Dena

Cisgender. Because "Genetic" (or non) is so 2006.


Please take him back
Some of us Catholics are not too happy with Deal Hudson, Screamin' Bill Donohue (born Catholic) and other self-appointed spokespersons for all matters Catholic. I know it takes all kinds, but it's hard to see Randall Terry and now Newtie joining the church. Wonder how long it'll be until Newt ditches wife #3?

You forgot to include former fundy Senator Sam Brownback (R-KS),
the one who not only switched from fundy to Catholic, but then joined Opus Dei!

[ Parent ]
Newtie could very easily teach graduate school-level seminars on the art of shameless hypocrisy.
I'm not the slightest bit surprised by any of this!  

Not even Former Governor Perfect Hair (aka Mitt Romney) is as good a master of this art.  (That's because his specialty is being transparently fake in his political convictions.)


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