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"Suck it, Jesus."

by: RadicalRuss

Thu Sep 13, 2007 at 18:53:40 PM EDT


So at the Emmy Awards the other night, Kathy Griffin won a statue for her show "My Life on the D-List."  Many people apparently find her funny.

At the ceremony, she said:

"A lot of people come up here and thank Jesus for this award. I want you to know that no one had less to do with this award than Jesus.  Suck it, Jesus.  This award is my God now."
Now the network that will be rebroadcasting the ceremony is going to cut the "offensive" comments from the edited version of the show.

*Sigh*  Oh, how the outrage now flows from the Catholic League's Bill Donohue and other annointed keepers of "the faith".  How dare someone use slurs to defame so many people's personal choice of self-expression!  (Remember how loudly Donohue and other Christian leaders leaped to defend John Edwards when Ann Coulter was calling him "faggot"?  Oh, right, they didn't.)

Weren't these the same people who cried "censorship" and derided the capitulation to Muslim fanatics when US newspapers wouldn't reprint Danish cartoons deemed offensive to Muhammad?

Bill Maher says this often, and I agree, that we Americans have way too much faux moral outrage.  I mean, c'mon, you believe that the Creator of all time, space, physics, and energy, who went to the trouble of engineering a Big Bang and shepherded tens of billions of years worth of cosmic thermonuclear reactions in order to create a life sustaining planet upon which He could create bodies to house souls and send His son to death by torture so you could go to Heaven forever even though you're a sinner by virtue of a fraud perpetrated by talking snake who offered a magical apple to a rib-woman, and you want to base our nation upon those principles and overturn 231 years of secular Constitutional rule, and YOU'RE offended by a D-list comedian saying "suck it, Jesus"?

Gee, I kinda thought that when an omnipotent, omniscient, omnibenevolent, infinite sky wizard has your back, a silly comedic remark would be a tiny concern not even worthy of note.  (I also kinda thought that the "thou shalt not kill" and "do unto others" majority in this "Christian" nation wouldn't illegally invade, use weapons of mass destuction, and torture the people of a sovereign nation that had nothing to do with 9/11.  Shows you how much I understand Christianity.)

But no, "suck it, Jesus" is this year's Janet Jackson Mocha Mammary of Mass Destruction™ - an event so offensive and threatening to American sensibilities that it must not be seen or heard!

Naturally, I turn to FAUX News for the pulse of the faux moral outrage (right below the jump):

RadicalRuss :: "Suck it, Jesus."
Lauren Green, FOX News Religion Corresponent.

So, it puzzled me at first, then angered me second, that she would accept an award and then insult a man who preached love and acceptance. Why would someone do that?

Because she's a comedian doing a joke about how celebrities and sports stars are always thanking Jesus when they win an award.  Comedians are known for telling jokes.

And from my understanding, Jesus once said, "Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me."  Or maybe it was "turn the other cheek", I forget which.

Needless to say, she offended me and millions of other Christians.

I don't know what went through her mind and why she would think that was cutting edge or even funny. But first, I want to actually show you that, in fact, Kathy Griffin is wrong. Jesus had everything to do with her winning that award. And here's the reasoning.

And here comes her train of thought:
  • Jesus died for your sins.
  • After that, Christianity swept Europe.
  • Christianity had a Reformation (so that we can gloss over Crusades and Inquisition - sorry!)
  • From the Reformation, society became one governed by the "rule of law".
  • From "rule of law" we get a secular Constitution, however, it calls for a Christian nation because...
Ninety-four percent of America's founding era documents mention the Bible; 34 percent quote the Bible directly. The idea of bringing unity to the universal is a particularly Biblical concept.  The freedoms we enjoy in this country to speak freely and to live freely are directly related to that man who died on a cross 2,000 years ago.
And this is the old "The founding documents of the states, colonies, cities, townships, etc. of Colonial times were chock full o'Bible, so we're a Christian Nation" argument.  Which, of course, is like saying that since the leaders of Colonial times were white men, this is a White Man's Nation (although this statement is more demonstrably true than the previous.)

Now, the founding document of the United States of America - the Constitution - makes no mention of God or Jesus or Bible, and specifically mentions:

...but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...

And the 1797 Treaty of Tripoli, which is applicable as US law since the Constitution says:
...all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land...
...and the Treaty, which was written the first time our country faced Muslim terrorists, specifically states:
"the government of the United States is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion..."
And that treaty was negotiated in the Washington Administration, passed by the 4th US Congress and signed by John Adams Adminstration, which I'd say is pretty representative of the Founders.  Those don't sound like the words of men instituting a Christian nation.  Now some Christian Dominionists will point to the Declaration of Independence's phrases like:
...the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them...

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

We, therefore, the Representatives of the united States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions...

And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honor.

(Emphasis mine, as Jefferson avoided using strong tags.)  These phrases seem intentional to me.  Why say "Nature's God" when you can say "Almighty God"?  Why say "their Creator" when you can say "the Lord God"?  Why "Supreme Judge" and not "Jesus Christ"?  Why "Divine Providence" and not "the Holy Spirit"?  (A fabulous review of the "Christian Nation Myth".)  And of course, when they reference the Declaration, they fail to note the secular nature -- the entire gist -- of the Declaration:
That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.
Get it?  Governance is mankind's right, not the right of kings, priests, or gods.  Government derives power from the people, not the Bible.

Back to Lauren Green at Fox:

So, you see, Kathy Griffin, Jesus has everything to do with you winning that award. You live in a free country where your abilities can be recognized if you're willing to work hard enough. That's at least the dream of America. If you'd been born in many other parts of the world, your daily activity might involve seeking out a way to survive, or even trying to avoid persecution and death. Luxuries like pursuing a career in the entertainment industry would never have been realized; luxuries like being able to insult the founder of a religion of forgiveness and acceptance would not have been possible.
More typical Amerocentrism from Fox.  Yeah, Kathy, good thing you weren't born in Canada, England, France, Sweden, Finland, Japan, India, or any of the major industrialized democratic countries - I understand they have no comedians or television there.

Another sentiment I often express is that most people treat religion as a tribal identification.  Someone's a Methodist or Mormon or Muslim not because they delved deep into the theological minutiae, but because that's what their parents are and most of their neighborhood is and their culture reaffirms.  "We" are Christians and "they" are Them.  Our book is better than your book.  My god can kick your god's ass.  That's the median level of religious understanding of your average "religious" American.

That would explain Lauren's faux outrage.  She's not upset that someone defamed Jesus (I doubt Jesus is, either), but that someone mocked her tribe.  She reacted like I would if you expressed that John Elway was a far better quarterback than Brett Favre (Blasphemy! I can't believe I typed it! The NFL was founded on the Green Bay Packers and don't you know I just offended thousands of Wisconsinites!)

Another sentiment: people that say they believe in God (90% by some polls) don't really believe in God, at least not in the details.  If they did, how would Kathy Griffin have a career?  Some of these God-believers must like her.  No, most people believe in God in the nebulous "there must be a Higher Power" sense, as in "the world's a scary, infinite, and sometimes unexplainable place; I hope something bigger is running it all."  (It's not.  Sorry, it's a whole lot of orderly processes affected by random events plus nearly infinite time.  Human beings were as likely as silicon rock-eating creatures writing "No Kill I" on the dirt near Captain Kirk's feet.  The fact we exist and think only proves we exist and think, not that there is a purpose leading to our creation, or even that there is a creator.  And damn it, reading Hitchens makes me re-read all my sentences to see if there was a more eloquent way I could've written them, and I can't.  I guess I don't drink enough.)

I guess I wouldn't have been too shocked at reading Fox and getting the "Christian Nation" argument, if not for this coincidental link I happened upon where CNN's Jack Cafferty reviewed a recent poll that found:

The survey measuring attitudes toward freedom of religion, speech and the press found that 55% believe erroneously that the Constitution establishes a Christian nation.

Most respondents, 58%, say teachers in public schools should be allowed to lead prayers. That is an increase from 2005, when 52% supported teacher-led prayer in public schools.

More people, 43%, say public schools should be allowed to put on Nativity re-enactments with Christian music than in 2005, when 36% did.

Half say teachers should be allowed to use the Bible as a factual text in history class. That's down from 56% in 2000.

...only 56% agree that freedom of religion applies to all groups "regardless of how extreme their beliefs are." That's down from 72% in 2000. More than one in four say constitutional protection of religion does not apply to "extreme" groups.

Well, in a country where a third still believe Saddam was behind 9/11, what should I expect?
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"Suck it, Jesus." | 23 comments
Thank you Jesus

For Kathy Griffin.   



It's the most appropriate
thing she could say to Jesus, especially as a female comedian.  From the Jesus part of the book (the New Testament):
First Corinthians 14: As in all the congregations of the saints, (34)women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. (35)If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church.

First Timothy 2: (8)I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.

  (9)In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

  (10)But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works.

  (11)Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

  (12)But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

  (13)For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

  (14)And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

  (15)Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

I've always thought it pretty clear that at least some of the founding fathers would have been thrilled to have religion disappear from our nation.  Did some of them see its influence greatly diminished in the future? I'm sure this is known. 

Imagine their horror if they knew about religion's current strangle hold on our country.

Oh and Russ, on this:

The fact we exist and think only proves we exist and think
Are you sure about that? :) (Yeah, yeah, I know that's close to an idea
from Descartes.)

Electricity's for light bulbs!

lawyer is her entourage
A couple of years ago, Kathy Griffin was a recepient of a Lambda Legal Award (Los Angeles Edition).  She immediately invited her lawyer up on the stage...turns out she travels with a lawyer...we're talkin a variation of Larry Flynt First Amendment speech rights lawyer on retainer...they told then some very funny stories of every version of "you can't say that".  Well guess what, if you're Kathy Griffin you do say it....good for her.  Jesus definitely had nothing to do with it.

Popular Topic
Nice post Russ!  Rick and KatRose have worthwhile diaries on this topic too.

It's mind boggling that its the twenty-first century and people actually still upset themselves over the idea of blasphemy.

Too bad, because she made a keen observation in a really funny way, which is what comedians are supposed to do.

"Our Liberties We Prize and Our Rights We Will Maintain" -- Iowa state motto


Great job, Russ!

Especially the quotation from that treaty.

But it doesn't matter how many speeches and essays of the Founding Brothers are quoted (or teraties), or how many books lay out their true religious affiliations and beliefs and practices (GW didn't go to church, etc.). 

Why?  Because that's history, and facts, and the truth.  And those who claim this is and always has been a Christian nation only have fantasy and dogmatism on their side, which stick to our ship of state like barnacles, and to the body politic like leeches.  These people will misinterpet everything based on a completely skewed vision of American history.  Nothing can shake them, especially the truth, which they must deny deny deny. 



"In order to maintain an untenable position, you have to be actively ignorant."  The Colbert Report

Thou shall not worship false gods

That is the word.

Is worshipping a plastic jesus worshipping a false god?

Is worshipping a mental image of jesus, which might not be a real picture of god, part of the problem?

The god handlers would like everyone to sign on to their plan and donate, donate, donate to their cause...stir up your obedience to the handler's version of god/jesus.

Ask questions.

Ask a lot of questions.

Use your mind....please.... 



Kathy Griffin
I have never heard of her.  But good for her.  If the Jesus-people don't like it, then they can suck it, just like their Saviour.


Nothing but PCness from the church nazis.

1. Comedians say it "like it is".  That's the number one rule of a comedian.  How can a comedian be funny if he is so PC and fear of offending people in the most ironic way possible (as opposed to Michael Richards' remark)?

2. The idiots at BoycottLiberalism just put Kathy Griffin on the boycott list because of her "blasphemous" speech.  Now only if they could get off their paranoid butts and add Paris Hilton.



Blasphemy
I don't find her comments particularly blasphemous, just cheap and trashy.  Is there anything to be gained by any side in the debate by being deliberately offensive to the beliefs of others? 

well said Russ
brilliant piece Russ....should be read by every American
in fact should be reprinted on the front of every newspaper...
and linked to every comment website......
this IS the 21st century....
not the middle east of 2000 years ago......
I could go on but Russ has said it all, thankyou!

soul
Interestingly, Ted Haggard has been known to use those very words!

Kathy Griffin--

--can be hilarious (I'd love to see her host The Oscars), and I've been waiting for someone, anyone, to satirize the pomposity of rappers and actors thanking Jesus or God for winning an award.  So what does that mean--the other nominees were cursed by God, they were sinners, spiritually undeserving?  In its own way, it's as pathetic as people surviving a hurricane and thanking God, which implies that those who were killed were God-targets for reasons best known to themselves and God.

Kathy Griffin is now in my Pantheon.  Time to find some incense. 



"In order to maintain an untenable position, you have to be actively ignorant."  The Colbert Report

Yeah,

I think the joke is on all the other people, and it was a joke.  Kathy's playful and shocking because she's a comedienne and it's part of her shtick.

I'm a boxing fan, and it's interesting in the post-fight interviews to see fighter after fighter "thank God for this victory."  Every other guy says that.  Like, "Jesus helped me mash up this other dude's face, 'cause we cool like that.  That's what he does.  He's a big fight fan."



[ Parent ]
Ross and Lev,

let's suppose that there is a God. 

If so, then, "Thou shalt not take the Lord's name in vain," seems less about not saying, "Sweet Jesus," when you see a whale breach, but rather believing that God wants your football team to win and invoking His name to that effect.

Under such an interpretation, Kathy Griffin isn't guilty of sacrelige, but nearly everyone else is. 

Even more heinous is the person who crashed her car and asserts, "God was really there with me," as opposed to all those poor suckers to whom God was indifferent and let the life run out of them...or all the times when the boxcar doors swung open at Auschwhitz and God, at least in regards to divine intervention, didn't give a shit.  But for that one woman who crashed her car, God was there because she was God's extra-extra-special-super-duper-beloved. 



[ Parent ]
Silverman
My favorite episode of her show has (black) God coming down to save Sarah from poo-ing in her pants when she meant to just fart because He heard her prayer over all others. Sigh, good times! Then they sleep together, but she wouldn't give Him her cell number afterwards. Blah!

Curses! My million dollar ideas foiled again: "God Bless Your Brand!" http://www.christvertising.com/

[ Parent ]
True story
Earlier this year my sister, who lives in West Africa, set out on a business trip to Lagos, Nigeria. Her first flight was cancelled for an unexplained reason and consequently she missed her connecting flight on Nigerian Airways. That flight crashed in the jungle killing all 260 people on board.

She wrote a letter to the entire family telling of the incident and then she claimed her life was spared because she had loved ones praying for her and God had blessed her with His grace.

One of my cousins wrote a reply-to-all pointing out that it was a very arrogant attitude since it implies that none of the other 260 people on the plane had any loved ones praying for them and that God refused all of them his grace and let them die in a fiery crash.

While I am glad my sister missed the flight and thus is still alive, I agree with my cousin about the arrogance of people who think they are God's personal favourite to the uncaring exclusion of others.


[ Parent ]
Yep, that gives me the creeps too.


[ Parent ]
I Love Kathy
Oh Kathy, it's incidents like this that make me love you even more than I already do.  Can't wait for season 4!

She's terrific!
And she has a quality that Wanda Sykes and the older-school Elayne Boosler have: they're not vicious.  Yes, they are sarcastic commentators on everything, but there's this gleam of wonder in their eyes and delight in their smiles: "Can you believe it?" 

"In order to maintain an untenable position, you have to be actively ignorant."  The Colbert Report

[ Parent ]
A funny pic
appropriate for those parading against blasphemy and other "sins." I'm with stupid.

Electricity's for light bulbs!

"jesus loves a winner" --becky lehman, "drop dead gorgeous"

i think kathy's point was to underline the ridiculousness of thanking jesus for your personal public successes in life.  once again, the fundies don't get it (big suprise).  jesus was a friend of the poor, and of the oppressed and downtrod.  he didn't care much for the rich and powerful or the hypocritical and said it many times.  you don't love or thank jesus by saying you love jesus or by thanking him in front of a crowd, you ACT like you love him and you ACT like you're thankful by following him and doing what he told you to do.   

bill donohue himself might as well be telling jesus to suck it, for christ's sake. 



The gays stole my lunch money

Bill Donohue does just that, from his gluttony to his absolute...
...unwillingness to suffer gladly for the Christ and to forgive forever for the Christ.

[ Parent ]
Kathy Griffin
I say go Kathy Griffin! I LOVE her.

"Suck it, Jesus." | 23 comments
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