News Tips?
-- tips@phblend.com

PHB Mobile


About
-- The Blog
-- Pam | My home page
-- Autumn
-- Daimeon
-- Julien
-- "Radical" Russ
-- Terrance

Contact the Baristas

The Blend Blogrolls

Activism


Best of the Blend
Blog Posts

Special Events and Interviews

Blend-o-licious endorsements...



The Christian Civic League of Maine's Mike Hein calls Pam's House Blend:
"a leading source of radical homosexual propaganda, anti-Christian bigotry, and radical transgender advocacy."

He is "praying that Pam Spaulding will "turn away from her wicked and sinful promotion of homosexual behavior." (CCLM's web site, 10/15/07)


Ex-gay "Christian" activist James Hartline on Pam:
"I have been mocked over and over again by ungodly and unprincipled anti-christian lesbians."
(from "Six Years In Sodom: From The Journal Of James Hartline," 9/4/2006, written from the "homosexual stronghold" of Hillcrest in San Diego).

"Pam is a 'twisted lesbian sister' and an 'embittered lesbian' of the 'self-imposed gutteral experiences of the gay ghetto.'" -- 9/5/2008



Peter LaBarbera of Americans for Truth Against Homosexuality heartily endorses the Blend, calling Pam:

A "vicious anti-Christian lesbian activist."
(Concerned Women for America's radio show [9:15], 1/25/07)

"A nutty lesbian blogger."
(MassResistance radio show [16:25], 2/3/07)


Pam's House Blend always seems to find these sick f*cks. The area of the country she is in? The home state of her wife? I know, they are everywhere. Pam just does such a great job of bringing them out into the light.
--Impeach Bush


who monitors yours Bevis ?? Just thought I would drop you a line,so the rest of your life is not wasted.
--"Joe"

Content © 2004-2008
Pam Spaulding

House Blend logo © 2005
Melissa McEwan

Photo of Pam Spaulding
© Judy G. Rolfe
All Rights Reserved.


SITE TERMS AND CONDITIONS
Support the Blend




An Online Magazine in the Reality-Based Community.



Allegedly Calling Her "It," Beverly Hills Hotel Removed Natal Woman From Restroom, Hotel

by: Autumn Sandeen

Fri Jun 06, 2008 at 16:15:00 PM EDT



"To be called an 'it,' I'm a human being, not an 'it."
--Songwriter Tanya White

Here we go again with the bathrooms.

Apparently last September, songwriter Tanya White was kicked out of the Beverly Hills Hotel's women's restroom because she looked too masculine. Oh -- and apparently hotel security called her the anti-transgender pejorative "it" in the process, even though she's a natal woman.

{Added note from Autumn: Natal woman (or natal female) is a shortcut term for women who are assumed to have XX chromosomes, and have lived as female since birth. Other terms used to convey similar meaning are cisgender woman, non-transgender woman, non-transsexual woman, non-trans woman, and genetic girl. Of these terms, I just personally prefer the terms natal woman and natal female to convey the idea.}

Well, now White and her attorney, Gloria Allred, are publicizing the incident. From the Los Angeles ABC affiliate (KABC - video included with the story):

Tanya WhiteA woman who says she was kicked out of the Beverly Hills Hotel while trying to use the restroom is demanding an apology.

Songwriter Tanya White admits she doesn't dress like the typical woman, but she says security guards went too far when they confronted her in the women's bathroom at the hotel last September.

White claims that even after proving she was a woman, they told her to get out and escorted her off the premises.

"The men said, 'You need to get out of the bathroom.' When Latrice said, 'She's supposed to be here, she's a woman,' security responded, 'It needs to leave,'" said attorney Gloria Allred.

White isn't asking for money -- at this point all she wants a public apology, and a changing of hotel policy to not discriminate on the basis of apparent gender or perceived sexual orientation.

Very reminiscent of the Caliente Cab restaurant incident.

Some of the "enlightened comments" of the ABC article readers/video watchers after the fold.

Autumn Sandeen :: Allegedly Calling Her "It," Beverly Hills Hotel Removed Natal Woman From Restroom, Hotel
- Guess the answer is if you look like a man and dress like a man then what does she expect? Especially with the number of perverts around.

- If she walks and talks and looks like a duck, she shouldn't be mad at being treated like a duck.

- Cool, now I can dress like a chick and hang out in the womens restroom !

- When you try to present yourself as something other than what you are it causes confusion and these are the results. She shouldn't have been referred to as "it", but she set herself up for this type of thing. I've found myself wandering what "it" is that has walked out of bathroom before because I couldn't tell if the person was a man or woman. Again not saying it's right but that's how it went down.

- It figures, Gloria Allred to the rescue. if that person choses to dress and exhibit the appearance of a male, then she should have been challenged for the safety of the other patrons. I would have done the same thing if I were the security officers.

- I once walked into a restroom in an office building I had never been in and immediately saw a woman who looked and was dressed like a man and I immediately went out and looked again at the sillouette on the door because I thought I had walked into the men's room by mistake - when I went back in, "she" said to me, you're in the women's room, and that she got that response all the time - you heard the song "dude looks like a lady" well, this "chick looked like a dude." Sad and pathetic, if you ask me.........

- What the heck did she expect being in the women's restroom looking like a man! She needs to be slapped and told that if you enter into a facility where it causes doubt & suspicion then you should be prepared for the consequences. And to make matters worse, she (it) didn't even bother to look like a girl on television. She (it) still looks like a man to me with that hat on and a man's suit. Come on girl....dayuum! I don't blame security at all. They did what they were suppose to do in this case.

- what if a little girl around 8, 9 or 10 went in this restroom by herself and saw "it" - how confused would she be not knowing if she should proceed to the toilet or run out of the restroom? You gotta be kidding me with that comment - people like "it" likes to play dangerous games - that's why Alred is representing it.

- there is no way I would give this person an apology - when they leave out the door everyday they already know what to expect, so, people are not required to apologize for someone who looks ac/dc

So if one doesn't conform to social gender norms -- such as in the way one dresses or in the way one moves or gestures -- then apparently (per the comments, anyway), one should expect to be treated badly when one uses a public restroom, should expect to be called "it," and shouldn't blame anyone but yourself for being harassed.

Yeah -- blame the victim. I get the message loud and clear...Many members of the public believe it's okay to be bigoted towards people whose gender presentations don't fit within societal norms.

.

Tags: , , , , , (All Tags)
Bookmark and Share
Print Friendly View Send As Email
action
do you have any contact info so we can take action?

http://www.queersunited.blogspot.com

But we can come back later and revisit including gender identity & expression
because, after all, it's just a minority of a minority that's affected.

FWIW, I'm transgender and am not aware of ever having been discriminated against because of it. I guess I "pass" pretty well. But that doesn't make it less of an issue for me because other people - cisgender, transgender, bigender, cogender, agender, intersex, postgender, or what have you still have to face this sort of thing.

This is my fight because it's the fight of my siblings. I care about this because it harms other human beings.




Claim to fame: Posted first PHB diary to be demoted


It is not all about "passing"
My friend of operative history is dealing with a bit of this now, not because of any male characteristics, but precisely the opposite, because people who had been dealing with her who had no idea later learned of her history. It disturbed them to the point that they are demanding that her employer cashier her.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

[ Parent ]
Absolutely
It's really time we just protect people against other people's bigotry and stupidity.

I was nervous about coming out after years of working at my present employer. Fortunately, things went well, but I could have been fired for something like "lying on my application".

Those of us who completely "woodwork" or "go stealth" (myself included) do nothing to help others who are on the same path. This is why I'm now "out" at work, church, and seminary.

Educating other people will help in the long run, but in the short run we laws that give people a fighting chance against bigotry. Individuals are losing employment, housing, and public accommodations now.





Claim to fame: Posted first PHB diary to be demoted


[ Parent ]
There's a comments section.
so, why aren't the blenders registering and posting comments on this site?

Anonymous comments to news articles...
are just as benighted in LA as they are in Iowa.

If you want allies, you have to be an ally.

[ Parent ]
And we have laws on gender identity and presentation
And still shit like this happens!  This is also proof the gender and gender presentation anti-discrimination laws benefit more then we trans people.  

laws don't prevent wrongdoing.
they simply provide an official avenue for recourse.

i agree taht the anti-discrimination laws covering gender expression definitely help more than just trans people.  gay people are also often picked on for our sometimes out of the norm gender expression.

Click HERE and sign up: Campaign For Military Partners.

Lurleen on Twitter.


[ Parent ]
Here is the contact information for
The Beverly Hills Hotel

General Manager:
Alberto del Hoyo
adelhoyo@beverlyhillshotel.com
Tel: +1 310 276 2251
And

Director of Human Resources:
Ava White
hresources@beverlyhillshotel.com
Tel: +1 310 281 2946
And also

Guest Relations Manager:
Ron Howard
rhoward@beverlyhillshotel.com
Tel: +1 310 281 2510

Be polite but firm


One more contact
Director of Public Relations:
Wendy Schnee
wschnee@beverlyhillshotel.com
Tel: +1 310 281 2958  

I am assuming....
If you have seen the video clip, Ms White APPEARS to be male, somewhat effete. I didn't realize until the end of the clip (I had missed the first few seconds) that this person was a woman. I ASSUME that the hotel employees thought that a man was entering the woman's restroom.

Just because someone is transgendered, gay, straight or something in between, it doesn't mean that all their actions are intelligent and correct. Ms White from all external appearances dresses and looks like a man. She can't blame people if they assume she is one.

If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck you can't be blamed if it is NOT a duck...


you know what happens when you assume...
White claims that even after proving she was a woman, they told her to get out and escorted her off the premises.

She can't blame people if they assume she is one

Assuming is one thing, but they should have apologized when their assumptions were proven false, not played the 'it' card and made a bad situation worse.


[ Parent ]
Oops
I just read your response after I posted.  Sorry about repeating the point.

[ Parent ]
I also have to ASSUME
Once again, viewing the video, I HAVE TO ASSUME that this is a constant and daily occurance that she is thought to be a man. Granted, the hotel employees could have been more considerate and understanding in dealing with her, but (now lob them fire bombs) Ms White is wearing a sign by how she chooses to dress and act, that says the same thing as 'kick me' (verbally speaking of course).

[ Parent ]
Not looking girly enough for your taste...
...means "kick me"?

"Our Liberties We Prize and Our Rights We Will Maintain" -- Iowa state motto

[ Parent ]
Apparently So
"Not girly enough" is an excuse to discriminate, to berate, to condemn, to belittle.

These attitudes, once consigned safely to the rubbish bin of history as far as acceptability, seem to be resurfacing, even in the LGBT community, where, alas, they once abounded.

The Mattachines used to exclude men who were "not masculine enough" from their ranks.

For some time, the Daughters of Bilitis excluded Lesbians who were not "womanly" enough, and later second wave Lesbian separatist organizations were obsessed with twisted standards of presentation and gender purity(though Second wave[european] I was never a rad-sep-les)

The statement, "kick me" along with Thomas' other objectifying and misogynistic comceptualizations written into his remarks, is simply frightening. It carries with it the idea that "she deserves to be hurt" or "she deserves to be discriminated against" just like the "she deserved to be raped because of her clothing" attitudes that we fight long and hard against.

I am the embodiment of mainstream feminine, if you will, aside from a penchant for European and New York fashion houses and the occasional pair of Pradas. That is my choice. Tanya has made her choice; it is equally valid and as a woman  she has the right to make that choice and to have it respected without having to conform to masculine standards of what a woman should look like and without having to be subject to discrimination, ridicule and persecuation because she defies men's fashion dictates.

 

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
That was my sorta my point, I thought...

...If we're saying discriminating against people based on non-conformance to societal gender norms is in some way the fault of those being harassed or discriminated against, then we are okaying all appearance based discrimination.

And, that would include appearance related harassment and discrimination that encompaces race, gender, faith/creed, visible disability, etc.  Societal accepance of appearance related harassment and discrimination is not in keeping with the kind of society I want to live within.

-----
~~Autumn~~

As if there were safety in stupidity alone.
--Henry David Thoreau


[ Parent ]
Thomas, yes, she shouldn't be surprised...
...when her gender is questioned.  I don't think that is her objection.

The security guards were right to investigate what they thought was a man in the women's room.  But once they became aware that Tanya is a woman, they should have left her alone.

They didn't, and that is the problem.

If you want allies, you have to be an ally.


[ Parent ]
Interesting choice of analogy
Usually, the person wearing the 'kick me' sign is quite surprised when someone actually kicks them.  

I believe the wearer of the sign would be surprised for two reasons.  One, a 'kick me' sign is something that someone else places on another person's back without the wearer's knowledge.  The person wearing the sign would be surprised because they don't realize the sign is there.  Two, practically everyone else in society understands that someone has played a cruel joke on the wearer and refrains from playing along.


[ Parent ]
Goodness Thomas
I suppose that we ought to all dress like June Cleaver to conform to your masculine sense of propriety.

So very odd that in so many states fundies are campaigning to force trans to be identified as their birth anatomical sex and here we have Thomas who lets us know that it is all about appearance.

Perhaps a policy of mandatory breast implants for the smaller busted whose figures might be confusing in profile, then? Or maybe corsets?

Keep it up Thomas; feminism needs a shot in the arm right now and your kind of condescending, misogynistic judgemental objectifications are perfect for that purpose.

My grandmother used to shake her head, grind her teeth and fire off the words "Holy Mother of God" as the intro to her reaction to this kind of attitude, and that was 40 years ago..

My reaction to hearing this coming from a member of the LGBT community is comparable...

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid


[ Parent ]
Maybe you can explain, Thomas,
why these MALE security guards pursued her into the women's room.  If the object was to create or preserve a properly "feminine" atmosphere, why was it all right for these males to be there?  (And, per the MSNBC report, they WERE male guards.)  Never mind that the incident should have ended the moment they learned her gender; the fact that the hotel uses male guards to police the women's room undercuts their whole argument--and yours.

Cynic, n.  A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be.  
-Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary


[ Parent ]
You're an idiot
In both cases referenced here the issue is NOT that there was confusion.

The issue is that once the confusion was resolved, the security guards in question didn't let it go, they persisted and become hostile, insulting, and threw the woman out anyway.

They crossed the line.

People who have an atypical gender expression are not idiots, they are aware that their appearance is confusing.  You'll note that in both situations they explained "yes, this happens all the time, I am a real woman" and provided proof.  The whole situation should END there.  But somehow it doesn't, and providing the trans equivalent of the "gay panic" defense is absurd, anti-intelligent, and bigoted.

The facts are that a woman is not going to be raped by a stranger in a bathroom, she's going to be raped by her husband, boyfriend, best friend, co-worker, classmate or someone else in her life.
http://www.rainn.org/get-infor...


[ Parent ]
It's alright to assume
I don't think the problem is in assuming that she is a man, Ms. White said as much.  But, when she proved that she is a female, then the hotel employees should have left her alone, and let her used the restroom.  



[ Parent ]
Straight question
First, it says that she "proved" she was a women.  You can't blame security for trying to make sure that men weren't going into the womens bathroom.  Once they found out she was a women they should have left her alone.

Second, I'm sorry to ask a stupid question but what is "natal".  I try to stay as current as I can but not being apart of the gay community it's hard to keep up.

Please let me know and forgive my ignorance.

Matt
www.idealcrap.com


[ Parent ]
I think
I have not heard that term before either, but by 'natal' I think the writer is meaning that Ms White was physically born a female, i.e natal meaning 'at birth'. But you see, once again I am assuming that is what is meant.

[ Parent ]
Look it up
Are you stupid or just lazy? There is no need to assume the meaning of a word you don't know. By the fact that you are reading and posting here means that you are using a computer  with a web browser, which means you have the ability to look up the meaning of any word you don't know in less than 10 seconds.
http://dictionary.com/

natal
-adjective
1. of or pertaining to a person's birth

And for Matt, you don't have to be a part of the gay community to keep current with the English language, especially the words that have been around since the Romans. ;-)


[ Parent ]
yes..
Look up the word "facetious"

[ Parent ]
Use of the word Natal
I know what the word "natal" means.  I didn't understand it in the context of the sentence.  If the person was born a female, and remains female to this day, then she is "a women".  By using the word "natal" the author implies that she was something other than a women, that the adjective was somehow germain to the story.

The true story was, "a masculine looking women was removed from a Beverly Hills hotel".  The fact that she was, in fact, a women seems to be of little consequence to the story.  The kicked her out because they didn't like the way she looked.  It was a simple as that.

But to use the word "natal" is redundant and implies that it is some kind of slang term.  If the author wanted to be ignorant he could have just used the term "butch" instead.

Just my thoughts.

Matt
www.idealcrap.com


[ Parent ]
Re: use of "natal"
The author uses the word "natal" because many of us might assume that a person being discriminated against for her gender expression is trans.  So this is just pointing out that the woman in question was born a woman.  It's not redundant, it's just a clarification.

[ Parent ]
Thanks Heidi
Thanks Heidi, I didn't think of it that way.  I read it to mean that she was born a women and had since transitioned, which wasn't the case.  I figured that you would only use the word like that if she wasn't a women any longer.

Also, without exposing yourself, how do you prove your a women?

Thanks.

Matt
wwww.idealcrap.com


[ Parent ]
My guess...
is that she tried to show her driver's license, or some other form of ID.

[ Parent ]
That means that non-trans women and non-trans men...

...are all allowed to be stopped by police or security personnel to verify the identification cards or carried medical documentation -- specifically to prove one is "real sex" one appears to be. I'm not comfortable with police having the power to demand to see ID cards -- or letters from one's doctor -- to prove a person's suspected sex or match the limited spectrum found within societal norms.

There is an societal assumption, voiced frequently of late by the conservative Christian press, that MTF transsexuals and crossdressed men are more likely to engage in predatory behavior against women and children than others in our society.  It apparently doesn't matter no one has funded or published a study to prove or disprove this assumption as accurate or inaccurate.

Having police act on unproven sex-and-gender assumptions based on solely on clothing, appearance, and a predatory presumption -- a presumption that cross-dressed men are more likely to engage in predatory behavior in restrooms -- strikes me as sexist and inappropriate.

Tanya White doesn't identify as male and is a natal female, but she was assumed to be a predator by hotel security because of her "male" appearance. To say I have lots of problems with that concept is an understatement.

-----
~~Autumn~~

As if there were safety in stupidity alone.
--Henry David Thoreau


[ Parent ]
You have to be joking, but if you are for real,
  The Ms. White was in the ladies room when security was asking her to come out of the ladies room.  If a woman is in the right place to pee or poop, it is no ones damn business what she looks, acts or what ever like she is a woman.  

 If and this is a big IF, Did the Ms. White assult anyone while there? Did she proposition anyone? Make a snide comment? Anything other than just go into the ladies room, pee or poop, wash her hands, touch up her make-up and exit.    

 Than security should wait for this person to come out on her own and politly ask her to follow them with out making a scene.  This would have shown professionalism by security

 Now I don't know about you, but most other people I know go in, do their thing and exit.  Even on the slowest day at McDonalds or a busy day at the Airport.  No one go in the restroom and eyeballs everyone before they pee.  Now if there is a person just standing there while there are open stalls, sure one might think something is up.  But other than that, it just doesn't happen.

 So to your final statement,

If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck you can't be blamed if it is NOT a duck...

 You are damn right I can, we live in the United States of America.  We are innocent until proven quilty.  If body piercings and tattos give you the EWWWWWS, that is your problem.  If a person decides to express thamselves that doesn't fit the "norms" and gives you the EWWWWWWS, again it is your problem.  American Citizens have the right to express themselves, it is not a crime, YET!!!

 

If I make sense? it was quite by accident.


[ Parent ]
At the very least...
It looks like KABC used the right tagline.  "Woman kicked out of women's bathroom"?  Couldn't have said it better myself.  Well played!

Stunning Responses at the ABC Site
I can't imagine how Tanya White could be more reasonable about this.  She even explicitly anticipates the idiotic "if it walks like a duck" argument made by one of the wags from the ABC site, indicating that she regularly receives such scrutiny, and that she deals with it maturely and with dignity.  But this went way beyond what even the most reasonable person can bear: the hotel staff insisted that she leave even after learning that she has a right to be precisely where she was--to say nothing of allegedly calling her "it."  I'm really impressed that she's only seeking an apology; it's a sign of real class.

One bizarre consequence of this is to reveal the hollowness of the arguments against inclusion of gender identity in ENDA.  The great bogeyman of the right is the fear that a tutu-clad predator will cynically claim to be of a different gender in order to use the "other" facilities, and of course, we must "protect the children."  But here's someone using facilities that, as it turns out, happen to conform to her natal sex--and they still complain.  

It seems pretty clear evidence (as if more evidence were needed) that the real goal is not to "protect" anyone, but to demand gender conformity.  


So true it bears repeating
"It seems pretty clear evidence (as if more evidence were needed) that the real goal is not to 'protect' anyone, but to demand gender conformity."

"Our Liberties We Prize and Our Rights We Will Maintain" -- Iowa state motto

[ Parent ]
Why do we have seperate bathrooms anyway?
I first asked myself this question years ago.  I was reading Card's Songmaster, and in the beginning where he is describing life in the Songhouse, there is a scene where the main character is taught Songhouse etiquette for use of the restroom, which is shared by all the students, male and female (and presumably intersex students, who are not mentioned).  So why do we make the separation?

Obviously it costs us.  We have to build and maintain separate facilities, staff them with people of the approved genders, etc.  And, while this might be a minor point, any person who has ever visited an amusement park in a mixed-gender group can tell you that the queue is always twice as long at the women's restroom.

So why do we do it?  What do we gain?  That we have always (in recent memory, anyway) done it this was is no answer.  Gender stereotypes are likewise not an answer: that boys and girls are different is not, in and of itself, a reason for separate facilities.  People might rant about "perverts", but I fail to see how separating the facilities prevents this; I am gay, and the thing that keeps me from checking out other men in the restroom is common politeness, not the sign on the door.

I think the real answer is the one eastsidekate hit on: it maintains gender stereotypes.  Nothing else that has been advanced seems plausible.

So... what do y'all think?  Is that the right conclusion?  And, if so, why aren't there more liberals up in arms for genderless facilities?


Given the number of unisex facilitiies in cosmopolitan areas in Europe
the issue of gender police in bathrooms is by and large dead there, at least in larger Western European Cities.

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

[ Parent ]
Yes, was a surprise to my Mom.
When she went to Europe in l963.  She said there were two doors, one marked women, or whatever and one marked for men.... but both went into the SAME room!

It's the Hammer of JUSTICE,
It's the Bell of FREEDOM,
It's the Song about LOVE between,
my Brothers and my Sisters
...All over this Land.


[ Parent ]
appearance fine, after you know...let her go
 Ms. White was accompanied by a woman into the bathroom, and proved that she was a woman and in the right facility.
Bam, end of issue.

Yep, hotel security were abusive after the fact and deserve to be held accountable for it.

 Content of character should still mean something in our society. And assuming gender identity makes a person a threat, is what we're talking about here.

 I gave Peter LaB as much a lesson on that. He at first tried to make it a safety issue, than a privacy issue when I wiped the floor with the former.
   What he doesn't get is when the public is INFORMED about gender identity, there is no need to fear those dressing or living as their opposite gender.

 I suggested that such education be extended to himself.
But you know how it is with him, he fears education too.


Genderless bathrooms need self-cleaning toilets and floors.....
just saying....the one at work is a one-holer, therefore used by all...some folks' aim needs work

spoken like someone who's never owned a penis
aim has nothing to do with it, Nancy.  Cleaning up after oneself is the real issue.

Women think that because a penis is shaped like a hose, it works like a hose, with urine coming out in an aimable fashion. The hole on our jimmys isn't a circle, it's a slit, a slit that has no muscles to control how it opens, btw.  The end of a hose stays the same shape, the penis doesn't.  So, sometimes you undo your junk and it comes out in one, aimable stream.  Sometimes it comes out in two, or three streams going in different directions. Sometimes it comes out like a fire sprinkler, going every which-a-way.  I've even had it come out at a 90 degree angle.  One time I managed to pee both in the center of the toilet and on my own shoes at the same time.  If you've ever seen a urinal, it has splash guards on the sides, and some even have them on the bottom.  If you've ever seen a man piss, we tend to lean forward and arch our backs while we're doing our thing.  If it was just a matter of aim, none of that would be necessary.

And aren't there women who are so "delicate" that they can't possibly sit on the toilet, so they try to hover above and  inevitably piss all over the seat?  


[ Parent ]
Menu

Make a New Account

Username:

Password:



Forget your username or password?




Join the Blend Chat Room



Report TOS Violations

Premium Sponsors



BlogAds






Search the Blend
Current site


PHB 2.0 Web
Search Blend 1.0 Archives
Ad Networks


BlogSheroes BlogAds


Miscellany

RSS Feeds

Subscribe with Bloglines

Visit NCBlogs


frontpage hit counter

Stats

Powered by: SoapBlox