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The Predator Argument Doesn't Work With Transgender Fifth Graders

by: Autumn Sandeen

Tue Jun 10, 2008 at 18:00:00 PM EDT



I feel like I've been talking about public restrooms way too much of late. Blame the news cycles; blame conservative Christians -- LGBT civil rights and public accommodation issues seem to be boiling down to which public restrooms transpeople are going to be using. It's of special concern, it seems, which public restrooms transwomen are going to use.

It's the perpetrator thing. Frankly, many women look at men who are strangers to them as potential predators, and these same women (along with their male protectors) perceive visibly transgender women who use women's public restrooms as potential male rapists. And if these same women (and their male protectors) have female children, they perceive visibly transgender women who use women's public restrooms as potential pedophiles. There's hasn't been any studies that have substantiated or unsubstantiated this fear of crossdressed males abusing women and children in women's public restrooms, but this fear of crossdressed, male, public restroom perpetrators is being used in an attempt to shape public policy on LGBT civil rights and public accommodation legislation -- most recently in Montgomery County, Maryland and Colorado.

But, the predator argument doesn't work very when we're talking about male-to-female transgender fifth graders. A ten or eleven year old who knows her gender identity doesn't match her* natal sex isn't going through the process of a social transition for sexual reasons. And, whether or not adults accept the idea that a fifth grader is self aware enough to understand when her gender identity and natal sex may not match, most are aware that fifth graders aren't public restroom predators. Shannon Garcia and Kim Pearson of TransYouth Family Allies have frequently reminded me that transyouth really are the future key to public understanding of how gender identity in transsexuals isn't directly correlated to sexuality.

So, since the scream of predator won't work for a fifth grander, Mike Heath (of the Christian Civic League (CCL) Of Maine) and his conservative Christian surrogates are now trying to employ a privacy related strategy. Paul Melanson, a grandfather to a student in the same class as the transyouth, has announced he's filing a complaint with the Maine Human Rights Commission (MHRC) -- which is seen as a first step prior to filing a civil suit in U.S. District Court at Bangor. From the Bangor Daily News article on the lawsuit announcement press conference:

L-to-R: CCL Leader Mike Heath, Students Jasmine Smith and Jacob McGurn, and Grandfather Paul MelansonJasmine Smith, 13, is concerned that next year the fifth-grader at Asa Adams Elementary School who identifies as a girl will be changing in the girls locker room.

At a press conference Monday night in front of the municipal building, the seventh-grader said that because she has seen the fifth-grader in the girls bathroom after school she assumes the student will be allowed to use the girls facilities at Orono Middle School.

"That would be an invasion of the girls' privacy and of my privacy," she said.

Smith acknowledged that no teachers or administrators have told students the fifth-grader would be changing in the girls locker room or using the girls bathrooms at the middle school.

Smith appeared at the press conference called by Paul Melanson of Orono, who formally has objected to the practice of allowing a boy to use the girls bathroom at the school. Melanson said he asked Smith to speak at the press conference to show that although school officials had told him the fifth-grader was using a teachers bathroom, he was using the girls bathroom.

The constitutional right to privacy is the basis right that found abortion legal in Roe v. Wade, so it's an interesting choice of argument for conservative Christians to employ. But even past that it's an interesting argument, the CCL's choise to employ a privacy argument against the transyouth just doesn't appear to resonate with the public in the same way as a predator argument does against older transgender people.

(Below the fold: Excerpts of comments left for the Bangor Daily News article Grandfather plans rights suit over boy using girls bathroom)

Autumn Sandeen :: The Predator Argument Doesn't Work With Transgender Fifth Graders
- Melanson is not the grandfather of the transgendered child - he is the grandfather of the boy who has been suspended twice for using the girls' bathroom. He encouraged his grandson to use the girls' facilities! As I understand it the transgendered child has been allowed to use alternative facilities. To those who don't understand how this child can know which gender she is supposed to be - when did you know? Did you think about it or did you just know. I feel bad for Melanson's grandson - children aren't born with intolerance - they are taught it. As for the petition to repeal equal rights - Is this the way Maine should be?

- i'm literally speechless that mr. melanson is going to such great lengths to hear himself talk. he needs to step back and put this into perspective. this is a child- a person. and a very nice child at that. she (yes she, not he) has a wonderful family who, unlike melanson, are not using their child as a pawn. while the situation is complicated, melanson is only making things worse. to top it off, this article is very one sided and missing some very important information. you CANNOT simply brush by the fact that this child identifies them self as a girl- the general public has no idea what that means. more research needs to be done to make this an turely informative piece. you're doing the entire community a disservice by putting melanson in the paper... he doesn't deserve the space... he's playing us all like an orchestra of fiddles, with his grandson (unfortunately) sitting first chair.

- Paul Melanson needs to butt out. His interest in getting his grandson and the Smith girl involved in this is pretty sketchy.

- WOW..this is pathetic to say the least. Especially on the part of the grandfather, just goes to show you can cause a fuss and get attention over ANYTHING now adays. Get a grip and leave the poor kid (yes, KID: boy or girl) alone. I hear there are much more terrible things in the world that we could be giving our attention to....

- gosh I love it when adults use children as their political pawns.

- Miss Smith should be taught to speak for herself, not for all of the girls of Orono Middle School in general. My daughter and I are concerned as well, but I sometimes wonder if she has more to worry about from some of the other girls than this child who wants to be a girl. Shame on you, Mr. Melanson, for not teaching your grandson about tolerance and for making him believe he must have what everyone else has or do what everyone else is doing. Why not teach your grandson to be a leader, think for himself, and be kind? I've taught my child that she doesn't have to like everyone, but she must be kind. I've also taught her that she doesn't have to do what everyone else is doing. God Bless the teachers and staff of Asa Adams for their kindness and their willingness to find a solution. God Bless the child's parents for the inner struggles they must face daily. My husband and I are not sure exactly how we feel about this. We don't really like it, but we would like to learn and understand. We also trust the staff of Orono Middle School to find a solution that meets ALL the children's needs. Needs, Mr. Melanson, not I want or I deserve, but I need. Like it or not, privacy, comfort, and trust are things children need.

- Michael Heath says a 12 year-old boy is not receiving same rights as another student. Yet he wants to repeal the same rights law which was passed some years ago. Heath's double standards shows his non-christian beliefs. Let's face it people, Heath is not a Christian and is the face of evil.

- You obviously have nothing better to do than make more trouble for this transgender child than she is already dealing with Mr. Melanson. To pull your grandson into your silly game is irresponsible too. Do you also teach your grandson to kick the child he's beating up when he's on the ground? Have you even thought about what this might be doing to this child who didn't ask to be different? Or are you too busy thinking about your own financial gain?

- These people should be ashamed of themselves! I hope I go to the Lord before Michael Heath does so I can witness the Lord chastising him and sentencing him to hell for all his evil doings on Earth! I can only find solace knowing he and I won't share the after life together!

- I think people are starting to overreact a bit. Wouldn't a better option be to create a single-facility gender neutral bathroom that anyone can use? All of this attention, media or otherwise, is just going to confuse the children more and teach them that hate is okay.

- You have to be kidding! Good job wasting the court systems time. These people need more to do.

- First off, unless students take a bath in the room, then it's not a bathroom. If it's not in the cellar, then it's not a basement. The fact of the matter is that these people are fighting over a toilet. Why is this Jasmine allowed to use a restroom in a school that she doesn't even go to? There are girls and women who are aroused by other girls and women, too. Sounds like a wide open sexually unsafe area to me. So, now Melanson, his grandson and Heathen all want to use the girl's toilet, too. Will someone please tell them that they can continue to sit down to urinate in a men's room, and if it's done in a private stall with the door closed, and locked then nobody will even know the difference. Also, have the authorities check Melanson, and Heathen's computers for child pornography. They sound like they are a little too involved in the subject to me!

- The adults involved in this case need to find a new hobby. Leave this poor kid alone.

Even some who are less than supportive of the transyouth are leery of CCL and company...

- I know many teachers at the Asa Adams school. THe administration did a lot to accomidate this student. This is a double edge sword situation. Both sides will end up suing. Also, be careful what you take from this article. A lot of what the Melanson grandson claims why he got suspended is not accurate. Remember, this is a 12 year old kid, whose grandfather has an axe to grind. But i do agree that if this student who thinks HE is a girl was using the girls bathroom, then he should be using the BOYS bathroom or a staff bathroom. Never the girls bathroom! But i know first-hand many facts that were described is this situation were either untrue or extremely over exaggerated.

- While I do share the opinion of others here that at this age it is inappropriate for a child to use a restroom facility not intended for his/her gender, I find it interesting that any time there is any type of disruption/story/scandal that involves sexual orientation or gender identity Michael Heath is called in to throw his useless two cents in. Spewing his typical hatred, and yet applying it now to a situation involving a 12-year old child, he manages to imply that by repealing a law that provides all of the citizens of Maine equal access to basic human rights (ie employment, credit, housing)things will be better, or to use his words like they used to be. If this is what constitutes Christianity, I'm glad that I make the election not to participate in it. Why the people of Maine continue to listen to this man or even consider him to be an authority is beyond me.

- That's the most ridiculous thing I've read in awhile. Both the lawsuit and the boy who identifies as a girl. Come on now.

- Seriously? Ok let's pick on a fifth grade boy now. If this guy gets any amount of money for this it will disgust me. He probably put his grandson up to trying to use the women's bathroom so he could have cause for a lawsuit. It is hard enough for transgender kids to grow up being ridiculed by their classmates. Good for him to be able to be himself at such an early age. I went to school with people who had to pretend to be some one else until they went to college. I would like to think that we live in a much more tolerant society today, but unfortunately that's not the case. Why not a simple solution, create a gender neutral bathroom that every one can use and the boy can feel comfortable using. It's not a surprise that the Maine Christian Civic league is involved with this. I really don't think that intolerance and discrimination are part of god's plan, but the Maine Christian Civic League hasn't caught on to that yet.

When conservative Christians can't paint a particular transgender person's use of a public women's restrooms in terms of predatory behavior -- such as with this particular fifth grader -- their arguments just don't seem to resonate with the general public as well. That tells me that if LGBT activists could slice the legs off the predator argument, we'd be more sucessful with the general public in arguing for fully inclusive civil rights and public accommodation legislation.

H/t: Dawn

~~~~~
Endnote:
* Use of female pronouns are used throughout this piece to refer to transgender youth because the specific fifth grader in question is a male-to-female transgender youth. There are female-to-male transgender youth too, so it would have equally as accurate to have used male pronouns throughout this piece, or a combination of both male and female pronouns (as in "him and her," "he and she," etc.) to refer to transgender youth.

~~~~~
Related:
* Mike Hein and Freepers Attack 11-Year-Old Transgendered Boy In Orono, Maine
* White Male Privilege & Women's Fear Of Crime Intersecting With Gender Expression & Public Restrooms
* When It Comes To Transgender People & Civil Rights, It Really Is Always About The Bathroom
* According To CitizenLink/Focus On The Family, There's "A New Type Of Predator" -- Men In Dresses
* If Dr. Dobson Were King, We'd All Be Wearing Depends

.

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Saw this in BDN
and saved to desktop to send along- RL got in the way. Good catch Dawn, and very well addressed, Autumn!

It's extremely gratifying to see more outrage in the comments on the side of the girl as time has passed; this must have been hellish for her, her family and the school this past year. And yet there is still support for Heath and Melanson. GAH.

Lemme play Devil's Advocate for a second, because this thought hit me earlier:

If a custodial LGBT grandparent raised any sort of ruckus with a school system for an entire school year regarding their grandchild, how likely would it be that DHS would be called and knocking on their front door?

I'd put it as at a high likelihood. Yet to the best of my knowledge, this hasn't happened to Melanson.

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."


That
..was my first thought; I'm so glad to see the complete absurdity and cruelty of this is catching on with the public, and some even seem to be aware of the fraudulent petition. The thought of the CCL making any headway on either front makes me furious.  

____________________

Donate to Carmen's Place


[ Parent ]
When in Rome...
I always go back to the question, where did separation of genders come from? In Roman Bath times all sexes bathed, (even) performed bodily functions in public, side by side without division of the sexes.

The separation of gender is a invention of bigotry, hate and fear.


"Right to Privacy" is still fairly new, in a legal sense
It comes from Griswold v. Connecticut, 381 U.S. 479, 1965. That case was about married (and only married) couples having a right of privacy regarding the use of contraception.

It was then expanded into other areas of ones personal life or certain relationships, such as marriage or parenting.

Because a right of privacy does not expressly appear in the Constitution or the Bill of Rights, I wouldn't count on the current right-leaning makeup of the Supreme Court to work to expand this right. (Nine Reasons to vote Obama.)

Is hater-Gramps in a custodial position over his grandchild? If not, he wouldn't have standing for a case. Anyway, I feel pity for his grandchild at being taught such intense hatred at such a young age.

I also wish the best to the young girl and her parents, who have more courage than these haters can ever know.


When I was a child...
I went to ballet lessons.
It was on doctors orders no less. He said I should do ballet to build up my foot muscles in my arches or i would require surgery for my badly 'flat' feet.

I enjoyed it, I was good at it, I was perfectly behaved.
But some of the girls mothers objected to 'a boy being in the same ballet class as the girls' and so I got kicked out of the class!

I was four years old!
Four!

How ridiculous is that!

So for years I just had to try and practice the ballet foot excercises as best I could until finally tai chi fixed my feet. And when I got another chance at ballet many years later my instructor was sure I'd go places, but my worsening disability nixed that.

My Mum still has my little ballet slipers and I fondly recall the memory of my last day at ballet when we were told to pretend to be butterflys and each in turn asked what colour we were and I insisted I was a rainbow butterfly. It seems so appropriate 28 years later.


that's ridiculous
There was one boy in my entire dancing school. I always hoped we'd get one in my class. Ironic, since I'm now a grown-up lesbian and spend a lot of time in either chosen or de facto women's spaces. In sixth grade boys and girls both played field hockey and flag football after school, and I liked both. Then in seventh grade the girls started playing field hockey against other schools, and the boys started playing football. Twenty years ago a girl on a football team was nearly unheard-of. I remember a magazine article about a girl who was a kicker and that was a big deal. I also thought it was really cool that the year I was in seventh grade was the year the all-girls chorus became coed. Only two boys joined and one dropped out before long, but I liked that we had a boy and not because I had a particular affinity for the boy himself, though in high school we did end up becoming friends. I guess even back then I didn't want gender to circumscribe my actions, and if boys were participating in the same activities I was, they were no longer "girl things," just kid things or pre-teen things.  

[ Parent ]
Bellydance too
I tried to learn bellydance (nb, men bellydance as well, always have, always will; the focus on women is entirely modern western) as an adult male considering transition and I couldn't get a look in. Predator fear was unbelievable.

[ Parent ]
That was cruel to have happen...
   to you Bats. Adults can be so cruel when it comes to things that are important to children. Things like that do need to change.

I'd rather be a lion for one day, than a sheep for my entire life.


[ Parent ]
Thanks!
Thanks for that PhyllisMs.
Very much appreciated.

It just goes to show that the view many people have of reality is ridiculously different from actuality. I, a well-behaved four year old, wasn't any threat to my classmates but their biases lead them to perceive me as one. Biases many would probably end up imprinting on their own children.

Thankfully, slowly, things like that are changing and bit by bit we are winning the war on discrimination, biases, stereotypes, dehumanising, 'othering' and the kind of weak generalisation thinking that justifies hatred and is the enemy of peace, tolerance, freedom and equality.


[ Parent ]
These guys like the sound of their own voices
I truly believe that's why they keep doing this. I listened to the interview between Heath and the grampa-bigot on the CCL website until I couldn't stand it any more. Honestly, they like playing a martyr, they like feeling put-upon, they like the outrage it affords them. Where I'm from this is called masochism and is treatable with either therapy or a single-tailed lash, depending upon the sufferer's preferences.

Autumn, you were fabulous in your discussion and detailing of trans issues and responding to this freakshow of perversions calling itself Christianity. Thank you for keeping on keeping on. I can only imagine how exhausting it must be to get up every day and fight the same fight over again.

And thanks so much for the nod - I appreciate it. (Thanks to Louise , too!)


The stories are indeed exhausting
but you know what? Compare this story with the responses back last October...

OT, but compare this story to the relative silence when Charlie Howard was killed in 1984- compare this story to the hatred of when we were kids growing up in Maine.

Little by little, things ARE changing for the better. Hatred is being slowly erased and all can benefit from that.  

"It goes on one at a time, it starts when you care to act, it starts when you do it again after they said no, it starts when you say We and know who you mean, and each day you mean one more."


[ Parent ]
I've said this before
Autumn writes, "That tells me that if LGBT activists could slice the legs off the predator argument, we'd be more sucessful with the general public in arguing for fully inclusive civil rights and public accommodation legislation."

If you want to win the predator argument, maybe we should start with separatist essentialists, oop sorry "feminists" like Michaigan Womyn's music camp.

Yes, I know they've given in, but there seems to remain a widespread feeling that mtfs shouldn't really be on site, still cling to male privilege/predator attitudes and, to use one of my favourite trans-bashing phrases, are "agents of patriarchy attempting to colonise women's experience". Whilst these anti-trans sentiments remain unchallenged,  feminism generally will be seen as supporting the predator arguments and anti-trans prejudice.


Stats or emotive rhetoric?
Could solid stats be the answer?
How could we go about getting really really good stats on crime and TG, both as perpetrators where they stand out disproportionatly for their difference and as victims where it current stats show TG people are extremely victimised.

Something really solid, with generally recognised authority so that anytime they raise this nonsense we can thump the study, wave it around in the air, chant it's name and metaphoricly rub their faces in it that we are disproportionatly the victims needing protecting not the predators.

Something we could get into headlines, place on the desks of officials and demand a response to.

Could such a study be prompted or arranged, could it be afforded, who would need to do it, how could we maximise it's credibility and how could we ensure it got the right publicity to have an effect on peoples understanding of the truth rather than the myth that they club us with?

Or, is it the wrong tool for the audience? Do we need better rhetoric rather than an update of the facts already often ignored?

They fight the reasoned arguments with alarmist rhetoric and while in this case it hasn't worked, elsewhere it has. Perhaps we need better rhetoric to reach the sections of the populace the reasoned arguments don't reach?


The question is...

..."Who funds a study on crime in public bathrooms that will draw conclusions that will be seen as mostly benefitting transgender and other gender variant people?"

That the out transcommunity is small, and in large part impoverished (so it can't create large funding streams), and there are no civil rights related funding streams that are specifically geared to do the kind of multi-city study on whether or not public accommodation and civil rights laws impact the number of attacks on women and children by crossdressed men in public restrooms prior to, and after a public accommodation law has been passed that would be needed...

Well, I believe data and information, in the near term, isn't likely to be compiled that would make for good arguments for public accommodation laws that would likely benefit many members of the entire LGBT community.  And, this is specifically because such a study would most likely be seen as a "transgender study," and as such the perception likely would be that this kind of study would only benefit transgender people.

-----
~~Autumn~~

As if there were safety in stupidity alone.
--Henry David Thoreau


[ Parent ]
Forget about the predator bit...

   How about a poll to query girls age 17 to 12 years on their fears, concerns, opinions, hopes, likes and dislikes, and reasons they may oppose or agree that transgenders, who practice life as males but wear womens clothes on occasions and how uncomfortable would they feel knowing a man dressed as a woman is using the restroom at the same time as they and query them the same about transsexuals who live as women.

   Forget about the predator bit. Just ask about their fears, how they feel. Does anyone who hates me, disagrees with me, bother to concern themselves with opinions of those who will be affected the most by sharing their privy with transgenders vs transsexuals?

   Adults don't pay attention enough to the cares and concerns of children, as Bats just posted about above. When will you who don't agree with me, refuse to understand my stand and point about the concerns of these who can't speak for themselves decide to consider "all" of those who will be affected?

   Isn't the emotive rhetoric the same the transgenders who practice life as male spew concerning their desire to use the women restroom?  Yes, it is no different. I just don't get to hear the opinions of the 17 to 12 year old girls view points here at PHB and I wonder why no one wants to address these girls concerns.

   Well, I WILL.



I'd rather be a lion for one day, than a sheep for my entire life.


[ Parent ]
Huh?
What?  Huh?  Either my brain has completely turned off or your post makes no sense...

[ Parent ]
Thank you...


I'd rather be a lion for one day, than a sheep for my entire life.


[ Parent ]
Except...
That the precedent has been set. White men and women were upset and afraid of desegregating facilities too. Toilets, changerooms, public swimming pools.

They had to learn to deal with their biases, their irrational fears. I'm sure their upset was real. Especially that of many white children.

But they dealt with it and these days most people don't have serious issues with desegregated public facilities.

We should though I agree deal with the very real disstress of those girls. Their feelings and fears are very real as I'm sure people raised on race bigotry had very real feelings and fears as irrational and false was their premises. Those girls should be educated out of their fears.

It's rather likely though that a boy in the mens toilets where cis-men are will be far more at risk than a girl in a toilet where transgender people are let in (based on current understandings of the stats) which is just one of several reasons I think that single-user facilities should be the standard for all future buildings and renovations.


[ Parent ]
Homogenizing Transsexuals...
  

I'd rather be a lion for one day, than a sheep for my entire life.


Restroom "predator fear" is uniquely American
In many European countries, there are no separate men's and women's public restrooms; both genders use the same restrooms. It doesn't seem to cause any problems.

Besides, male predators don't need to dress like women to get into women's restrooms. In the mid-1970's women were afraid to go into the restrooms at rest stops on I-75 because women were getting raped in these restrooms at an alarming rate. The attackers were not transgendered or cross dressers; they were heterosexual men dressed as men who had found a high-traffic, low-risk hunting ground that provided them with lots of victims.

Besides, sexual assault is about power and domination. I think it would be highly unusual for a male sexual predator to dress as a woman to gain access to his victims. Wouldn't he view dressing as a woman as a loss of power? I don't think the average sexual predator would assume what he would see as a less-dominant role.


I don't trust the uniquely amerikans...
    This country is very different. This isn't Europe. Why do you think amerikans would behave like europeans?

I'd rather be a lion for one day, than a sheep for my entire life.


[ Parent ]
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