Conservatism in the wake of Jesse Helms

Great post

for here's the Maine GOP platform, from their website.

I had never seen their agenda in writing and it confirms the unease I've felt every time I go to north of Augusta (aka the 'other' Maine) for the past decade.

I grew up in that "other Maine", but it wasn't like this. Something happened to the tolerance, the mindset of Mainers. Gee, just as an example, ya think it's tied to the TRIPLING of churches in the Bangor area???  

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by: Louise @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 09:18:18 AM CDT

And there's also...

... this link, with an interesting news story quoting the head of the Penobscot County GOP, Lois Bloomer:

http://www.mainedems.org/109.html

So I guess "conservatism" is now defined, at least here in Maine, as "You're cold and hungry? Then you made bad choices, didn't you?

Sucks to be you!!"

If we can get her linked tightly to Susie Collins, Tom Allen will be a shoo-in.

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by: Louise @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 13:16:20 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Link

to original BDN story.

http://bangornews.com/news/t/c...

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by: Louise @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 13:22:22 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The White House referred to Jesse as a patriot.

That said it all for me. I certainly do not put Jesse in that category.

There are factions within the Republican Party - "It's My Party, Too;" "Log Cabin Republicans;" "Main Street Republicans." These groups seem to want to move the Republican Party to the center. Unfortunately for them, the Republican Party is owned by the right-wingers. You cannot have one without the other.

I said yesterday that Jesse just out and said things the way he felt them. Today's right-wing, by and large, uses snake-oil terms to mask how they really feel. "Protecting traditional marriage" does not sound as bad as "We hate gays." How they really feel, though, is still there, one just has to find it.

In 2000, Dubya campaigned as a "compassionate conservative," whatever that meant. Eight years later, we have seen no compassion, but a lot of conservatism.

The GOP has a legacy that it has created. Their snake oil terms still mean the same things they meant fifty years ago, when they screamed of "state's rights" and "judicial activism." What they feared then is what they fear now: change, a new status quo, an evolving society, a more perfect Union.  

"I like your Christ, but do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ." ~Gandhi

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by: keithan81 @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 09:46:56 AM CDT

Today I think

a good "patriot" could be defined as one who would stand up in a public forum and say:

   

You know what? Yes. Yes, we are all different. We are a country made up of folks from all walks of life, all colors, all genders, all religions. We can define ourselves that way, sure.

   Or we can define ourselves simply and more accurately as Americans. To be able to not see each other by those other limitting terms, but to see ourselves as part of a whole. And having done that, we can work together for equality and full rights for ALL americans, not select few.

   We HAVE to. Otherwise, the "United" States will be continue to be reduced to a misnomer even more than it already is. Individuals will be discriminated against, harmed or killed, in a country that should be for ALL of us, equally and freely.

   Let's work together, NOW, to truly honor what the Founding Fathers meant for this country. Not to minimize, pick and choose based on our bigotry and hatred, but to STOP the madness now. For a better day and a better country.

Please, Candidate Unknown... stand up and say this or similar. We need you.

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by: Louise @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 10:02:05 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

If . . .

. . . you run, Louise, on the above platform, I'll happily vote for you. ;)

It's tradition, that makes it okay. Hip-hip hurray it's weasel stomping day!
Weird Al Yankovic - Weasel Stomping Day

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by: AlexM @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 15:17:44 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I can't even drive in summer/tourist season

w/o obscenity... not good. Far more reasonable on the Internet than in RL.

Besides, my husband would look prettier than me at my inauguration- sob! ;)

But thanks, AlexM!

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by: Louise @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 16:50:56 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I completely agree, keithan81

At least you knew where you stood with Helms. The GOP is still owned by the fundie wing, and only the rest of the GOP can take it out. Will all their money, influence and power, they cannot drop kick Dobson and Co. out on their keisters because the fundies know how to round up the faithful in the pews, and the Republicans have to do very little to get out the vote with those masses.

Today's GOP can't even sugarcoat its use of the Southern Strategy to divide and conquer based on bigotry; Ken Mehlman even apologized for those tactics on behalf of the party. Unfortunately between Katrina and the crazies who back the immigration policies of Tancredo, any "outreach" pretty much falls on deaf ears.

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by: Pam Spaulding @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 15:00:13 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Somewhat off topic, Pam, but...

Jesse held up every single Clinton nominee for the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals from North Carolina. That left our state, the most populous on the Fourth Circuit, with no judges on the appellate court.

What is on the main page of Senator in Absentia Liddy Dole's Senate website? You guessed it - demanding up or down votes for Bush's judicial appointments. The hypocrisy never ends.

I bring up Dole because she will do her best to maximize off of Helms's death. She is, after all, his predecessor in the Senate. But I think it is unknown outside of the state that Jesse never won by landslides here. I believe his stellar constituent services played a huge role in returning him to Washington each time he asked. Dole's constituent "services" are minimal, to say the least (and that is a compliment). At the same time, Jesse knew how to play on racial fears. Dole's first ad for re-election was based on - don't hold your breath!! - racial fears, except she seems to be more focused on Hispanic racism.

But that does not matter. Racism is racism, no matter to whom it is directed.  

"I like your Christ, but do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ." ~Gandhi

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by: keithan81 @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 17:25:34 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The Illinois GOP (what GOP!?)

The Republican party in Illinois is virtually non-existent. Illinois overall is a very blue state.  The Democrats hold all state constitutional offices.

Downstate is still quite conservative, but not quite like the South.  We also have DuPage County to the west of Chicago with GOP retreads like Jim Ryan and Joe Birkett, but even that county is becoming more diverse.

The suburbanites sometimes complain about the "blacks and Mexicans" that are "flocking" to the suburbs. It is true that the demographics are changing, due to lower cost housing in the suburbs, and the gentrification and revitalization of neighborhoods here in the City (that's Chicago). This is causing the younger generation (mostly white, but not exclusively) to come and live and work in the City.

So the GOP has no leader or standard bearer in Illinois.

But remember, we do have The Peter. He is fun to watch, just like fish in an aquarium.

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by: JJ in Chicago @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 09:59:59 AM CDT

Illinois

Just to second JJ, although from a slightly different angle, there are Republicans in Illinois, and it's not completely blue here, with the exception of Chicago, where Republicans generally don't bother to run.  However, the state party has learned the hard way that Helms-style bigotry doesn't work here:  conservatives of that stripe don't win elections in Illinois.  Their last standard bearer was Judy Baar Topinka, who ran for governor in our last election and was largely indistinguishable from the Democratic incumbent (although probably would have been more effective at governing).  If a Republican is elected to statewide office, he or she is almost sure to be one of that vanishing breed, a "moderate."  Legislators are a mixed bag, but even our "conservatives" have moved away from the Helms mold.

Please do remember that Illinois was the first state to repeal its sodomy law, and, speaking of LaBarbera, he can't get an anti-marriage referendum on the ballot.  We haven't lost that little streak of progressive goodness.

Hunter

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by: Hunter @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 11:46:09 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

There's a GOP in Massachusetts?

You can almost fit them into one single ballroom.  The social conservatives of consequence in Massachusetts are Democrats, but they aren't especially powerful now that Tom Finneran isn't the House Speaker and Billy Bulger isn't the Senate President.

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by: oddjob @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 10:08:53 AM CDT

Do you ever see the rest of the party finally jettisoning this fringe?

Not for the forseeable future.  If they did that there would only be left the Rockefeller Republicans now referred to by the rest of the party as "RINO's", like the GOP was when I was a child in the 1960's.

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by: oddjob @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 10:18:20 AM CDT

(Oh, there'd be Goldwater's libertarian wing, too, but that doesn't change the gist of my observation.)

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by: oddjob @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 10:19:49 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Conservatism vs. intolerance

I never thought it made much sense to call the kind of bigotry that Helms did and Labarbera do spew 'conservative.'  It's intolerance, and people who feel that way like to call themselves conservatives in order to make it sound like they have a real place in the discussion.  I think people like Bob Barr, Ron Paul and others get it, and more will get it as time goes on - just like they did with racial intolerance.  There will always be those (like Labarbera) who never give up.  And well they shouldn't - they deserve to stay right where they are.

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by: lampster @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 10:37:40 AM CDT

It's interesting, because in Europe

David Cameron is perhaps the most prominent conservative

He spoke recently on internment without charges:
"If you don't have the evidence, then you should come down in favour of liberty."

He may lead the Tory party in the UK, but the Republicans would drum him out.....

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

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by: MauraHennessey @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 17:37:18 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

That USED to be what conservatism meant!

The fundies have bulldozed most of that from the GOP so they could turn it into a party promoting theocracy and their version of Shari'a

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by: oddjob @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 17:59:17 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The Tory Mayor of London

spoke at Pride 2008.
Same day, LGBTory officially began..

As opposed to our LCR's, LGBTory is an official part of the Conservative Party....

The Lord Mayor of London has OUT LGBT staff and an OUT deputy mayor....

I tell you Chica that no greater abomination exists than women denying their spirit of sisterhood and instead becoming the oppressor. -Rebeca, Universidad Complutense de Madrid

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by: MauraHennessey @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 21:30:40 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Ron Paul...

...made repealing anti-discrimination laws a much more central part of his platform than even most religious-authoritarian Republicans I've seen.

Either way, though -- plutocratic authoritarians, theocratic authoritarians, or some combination of the two -- the GOP is an avowedly authoritarian party.  The Dems...slightly less so.

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by: M @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 21:54:51 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

All those missing GoOPers from Illinois and

Massachussets must have landed in Oklahoma where the NUMBER ONE issue on their agenda is social legislation.

http://www.okgop.com/images/OK...

I. FAMILY Preamble: Traditional marriage, consisting of one man and one woman, is designed to provide each family member's physical, emotional, financial, spiritual, and social needs. Both parents are needed to support and encourage happiness, health, and a good education for their children, creating the next generation of citizens who are constructive members of society. Multi-generational families foster mutual respect and cooperation while providing support for extended family members and forming enduring relationships. We believe God is the Author and Creator of human life and that each individual should be treated with dignity and compassion. We insist that any candidate receiving money and/or support from the Republican Party shall affirm and promote the Pro-Life concept.

So much for tolerance - eh?  Republicans around here... and they are EVERYWHERE... are generally intolerant (fearful) of those who are not white, Baptist/Charismatic, and natives of the region.  There is a progressive portion of the population here, but they certainly don't stick out!

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by: Bodean @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 10:49:00 AM CDT

You're right

the LaBararas of this world should keep on raving. As they try to become more  devisive, they appear loonier, while  rest of us learn to accept our differences. They're on the wrong side of history. Like Helms (who was irrelevant at the end) they will look like throwbacks to a time of intolerance and bigotry.
It's funny that the "marginalizers" become the marginalized.  

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by: hank @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 10:58:55 AM CDT

I am not as hopeful as I'd like to be

as the old guard of conservatism dies off.

Jesse Helms was an unabashed bigot. He was proud of his intolerance and cared not a whit what people thought of it. He and his ilk are dying off now. While that is a cheerful thought, what scares me is the next generation of conservatives.

There is a rumor here in Maine that Michael Heath might be on his way out of the Christian Civic League, to be replaced by Michael Hein. Heath is in the mold of Jesse Helms - brash, arrogant, media-hogging bigot who is unashamed of being a real ass.

Hein is scarier. He is more savvy, more conniving, and more diabolical. He will work with other hate groups, form coalitions and cooperative efforts, learn from them and do some real damage to the progressive movement, both here in Maine and nationally. He is of the "snake oil" persuasion, who couches his words in politically correct terms. While Heath hates "homosexual activists" Hein "protects family values". Heath will charge at you full-on, face-first. Hein will remove your kidneys from behind and leave you to bleed to death before you're quite aware what has happened.

While we can rejoice at Helms' demise, we need be ever-vigilant to the wave that follows. There is an undertow there that can kill us if we are unaware.

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by: Dawn in Maine @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 11:46:14 AM CDT

From the frying pan

and into the fire...

When I was in Bangor a few weeks ago, I was flabbergasted to see how many new HUGE AND EXPENSIVE churches are out on outer Broadway now- remember when it used to be just farmland and Bangor Christian?

You know- not the school, but the lil church Rev. Herman "Buddy" Franklin started, then lost to scandal when he was forced to admit to adultery back in the 1980s? (I also want to say there was something about the books being cooked...) Jerry Falwell himself stepped into the role of temporary pastor as a measure to calm the frightened sheep and restore order.

And somehow Buddy also managed to have a huge house on Dole Hill Road in Holden, overlooking the entire Bangor/Brewer area. The real estate out that way would place that house at about half a million now- gee, how to you think he could afford THAT??

Will keep an eye on the Heath/Hein situation; something smells bad about this besides the obvious. I wonder why Heath is REALLY stepping away, if indeed he is...

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by: Louise @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 12:41:18 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

It's because essentially economic "conservatism" is dying.

And has otherwise earned a bad name for itself.  I call the kind of governments Conservatives like to create a "lootocracy".

If you count up all the people in this country who still think economic conservatism works, you'd get a little less than half of Congress and maybe a couple of metro cities worth of people.

Republicans are in a bind.  The old core of their party is economic conservatives in the sense of people-who-want-to-talk-about-taxes-while-looting-the-government, but they cannot get enough people to sign up for that, so they have to appeal to people who "fear" diversity using hate and fear.

Wedge politics, baby, all the way!

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by: Firefly @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 12:36:26 PM CDT

Oh those wacky Freepers.

I'm not going to link to them but they are comparing Helms to the glory that is the retooled Reagan legacy.  It's fairly creepy.  I wonder if that troll on the other thread came from there.  Oh we liberals are such haters!  
(Amazing things happen when you combine stupid, more stupid, and even more stupid with anger management issues.)

My America includes LGBT families.

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by: Mena @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 13:38:13 PM CDT

As the average US citizen becomes more open minded

and globally aware, the extremes become more extreme.  This is the case of US conservatism and the Repubevangelical party which is no longer the Grand Old Party it was (fostering financial conservatism and keeping the government out of peoples private lives).    Right now the religious right (Christian/Catholic orthodoxy) is, in principle, pushing for the same control that the islamofacsists have over countries, but it is only a matter of time before the religious right starts using the same tactics as the radical muslims (and, even some haredim).

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by: ol cranky @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 13:58:33 PM CDT

Repigs in Louisiana are just like Democrats in Louisiana

Baptist or Catholic, anti queer, anti choice, and on the take.
There are only tiny enclaves inside New Orleans proper, which are even slightly progressive. Bywater area is one of the gay ghettos.

"race, taste. and History finally overcome....and you ain't there"
by Tony Kushner

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by: peteyPornpig @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 14:53:30 PM CDT

GOP in NJ

Is on life support. After chasing away the good government REpublicans and silencing the "country club" types (see Christie Todd Whitman, who must be in witness protection), the GOP is increasingly irrelevant. There's not been an ELECTED state-wide elected GOPper since Whitman decamped to EPA. And none in the forseeable future.

It's not that some of the Dems aren't horribly corrupt knuckle draggers, they are, but the worst of the Dems are still more COMPETENT than the remnents of the GOP.

Milicent Fenwick must be rolling in her grave....

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by: brat @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 18:18:17 PM CDT

not to mention

in NJ one of the Republican Freeholders who tried to keep the late Laurel Hester from passing on her pension to her partner was defeated.

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by: Pam Spaulding @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 19:25:01 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The freeholders

On the Hester story: The GOP Freeholders in that case were severely spanked by their own party and Gov Corzine. Political arms were twisted until broken.

The number one rule for NJ, is, while the state political culture runs on corruption (both parties), a pol MUST NOT make the state look like it's Mississippi. If they do, they're gone.

I joke the reason NJ passed the CU, (and eventually marriage), is they want EVERYONE to come to NJ to get married....so the locals can pick your pocket. It's equal opportunity theivery....  

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by: brat @ Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 06:13:56 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

The Answer to the question,

  Do you ever see the rest of the party finally jettisoning this fringe?

 Not this election as they are all to busy trying to jettison the failed Bush conservative policies without looking like they are.

 As you mention, "security moms" and womb control, I believe they will want economic security as well.  Double plus not good for GOP.

 The GOP here in Denver, Colorado are running ads all over the place trying to make the Republicans the ones to vote  for to put common sense into Washington DC.  They are trying to be the friends of the enviroment as well.  Mean while it is the GOP that is allowing Mountaintop Removal Mining in the Appalachian Mountains and wanting to do this in the Rocky Mountains.

 From what I gather the GOP needs the religious wackos to even stand a chance at winning.

If I make sense? it was quite by accident.

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by: HappyCat @ Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 23:02:32 PM CDT

From what I gather the GOP needs the religious wackos to even stand a chance at winning.

And THAT is the heart & soul of their problem with the deal they made with the devil back in the late 60's.  There aren't enough fundies to all by themselves deliver the GOP the victories it wants, but there are enough fundies to guarantee the GOP defeats if it pisses the fundies off.

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by: oddjob @ Sun Jul 06, 2008 at 18:03:36 PM CDT

[ Parent ]