Nothing Changed

This very morning...

...my 16 year old daughter woke up and thought, "My actual next door neighbors hate my family, because I have two male parents, and voted in an attempt to expunge my family from existence. Along with a lot of other folks up and down our street." (We live in a San Diego suburb. We had our one No on 8 sign trying to balance out 7 yes on 8 on our street, plus uncounted bumper stickers.) She pondered it a bit more, then then told me, "Well, they're over 70. By the time I'm able to vote, they'll probably be dead, along with lots of other folks that voted yes on 8. They'll be dead, dead and gone, and me and my friends will step in and fix this mess."

As Californians, it's been really, really hard for us today. Somewhere in our hearts, we're simply ecstatic that Obama is our next president. But that joyous feeling is being crushed by the knowledge that a majority our fellow citizens believe we're so perverse that we don't deserve the same civil rights as all other Californians.

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by: LesGS @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 02:55:32 AM CST

That's my hope

We just have to wait for more people to die off.

TerranceDC
http://www.republicoft.com

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by: TerranceDC @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 09:28:01 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Can't we just have faith in America...

...and not California?

I know this sounds like snark, but it's not.  I'm incredibly proud of my country and mostly happy about the election.  But bigotry isn't gone, and wouldn't have been gone no matter how Proposition 8 went.  

We've got a lot of work to do.  

I don't blame anyone for being really upset over Prop 8.  I'm upset over it, too.  I'm just quickly getting to the point where I'm ready for the next battle.

I'm only a click away.

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by: JulieWaters @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 04:26:07 AM CST

The next battle?

The next battle will be the economy, ending the war in Iraq, fuel independence, etc., and I'm down for all of that. I'm down for the common good.

I'm just tired of the common good not including me and my family, and sometimes that leaves me thinking "Why bother?" Why push myself and pour my efforts into all of the above when, at the end of the day, the message is still "you can sit there, but not here"?

If I didn't have children whom I will someday have to leave in this world, there are times when I'd say "let it all go to hell."

TerranceDC
http://www.republicoft.com

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by: TerranceDC @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 09:31:27 AM CST

[ Parent ]

By "the next battle..."

I specifically meant over getting rid of Proposition 8.  Sorry to have been unclear.

I'm only a click away.

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by: JulieWaters @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 17:44:13 PM CST

[ Parent ]

How can we?

Are you Californian, by any chance?  It sounds like you are not, in the way you phrased this.

I am Californian.  I have always been proud of my home state - we're not perfect, not by a long shot, but for the most part we're very good.  And we're a damn sight better than huge chunks of the country.  There's a reason CA is known as the Left Coast and all that.  

The passage of Prop 8 tore huge, gaping wounds in my self-perception and my identity as a proud Californian.  Faith in America is great, and yes, I do have it.  But it is, for now, overwhelmed by the crushing knowledge that 52% of my fellow Californians think that I am a second-class citizen and not worthy to share the rights they take for granted.  

My faith in America cannot just erase my shame in my beloved California.  I'm glad you're quickly ready for the next battle.  But please be kind to those of us who are deeply wounded by this defeat and who are not bouncing back as quickly as you are.

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by: Nikaia @ Fri Nov 07, 2008 at 00:37:34 AM CST

[ Parent ]

I Feel Your Pain

Although I'm not gay, I feel your pain.  I have a brother who's gay and he and his partner have been together for about 20 years.  In addition, because I was born transsexual I'm in legal limbo when it comes to the marriage issue.  Marriage equality would solve virtually all my legal issues.

I think this defeat is only temporary.  Hopefully the absentee and provisional ballots will change things.  If not, then maybe the legal challenge thhat's already been filed will.  We will get there, we will get our full civil rights, we have to keep pushing forward until justice is ours!

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by: xrk9854 @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 04:40:56 AM CST

Puzzled

Is it possible to have a direct plebicite (sp), Prop 8, go directly to state constitutional law without some kind of ratification process? There must be some brilliant gay or lesbian Ivy League law school grads out there who can force this shit up to the Supreme Court and once and for all stop this madness. I find it hard to fathom that the majority can write true discrimination into state constitutional law without some kind of buffer process. Think back to the ERA in the 80s...or late 70s. Something is seriously wrong with this legal issue.

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by: bostonian queer in dallas @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 05:20:56 AM CST

It's a quirk

in the California process -- a bare majority vote can pass a constitutional amendment.  One of the lawsuits deals with this -- the idea is that any amendment which removes a right guaranteed by a fundamental part of the California constitution is a "revision", not an "amendment" -- and a revision is much harder to pass.  If the California Supreme Court agrees with the argument that "equal protection under the law" (the basis for their ruling this spring) is a fundamental part of the California constitution, then anything trying to remove equal rights is a revision and not an amendment.  This would, ironically, mean that prop 8 will have strengthened marriage equality, as there definitely isn't enough support in California to pass a constitutional revision to eliminate marriage equality.  (And yes, I will gloat mightily if that's how it turns out.)  It would also strengthen the constitutional protections of any other group whose rights might be temporarily unpopular at the ballot -- and most people are probably a member of at least one of those.

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by: M @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 12:02:23 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I agree

And it's something I bitched about - how could an amendment to the state Constitution be passed with a simple majority, while some budget measures require a 2/3 majority?  That made no sense to me.  As M said, it's to do with the difference between minor changes and major changes, and hopefully (probably?) the Court will rule that something which selectively chooses a group of citizens to exempt from the basic equal protection clause is a major change, which in my understanding requires that the relevant change must pass through the Legislature before going to the voters.  And since we have a Legislature that not once, but TWICE passed bills legalizing SSM (although the Governator vetoed it both times), it is extremely unlikely that a revision to the state Constitution banning SSM would make it through to even be voted on.

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by: Nikaia @ Fri Nov 07, 2008 at 00:42:37 AM CST

[ Parent ]

What We Must Do Now

Yesterday was not a good day for me. I felt as though I had been punched in the stomach.

There's plenty of blame for this to go around starting with President-elect Obama, who stated his opposition to gay marriage in an interview with MTV just a few days before the election. African-Americans voted overwhelmingly in favor of Proposition 8. Obama could have spoken out forcefully to members of the Black community against Prop 8 but he did not. Then there's the governor of California, Mr. Schwarzenegger, who promised gays he'd be there for them in this battle but did nothing. Some criticism of the tactics of the "No On 8" campaign appears to be valid. Finally, I think the gay community nationwide failed to mobilize so as to counteract the activities of the Catholic Church and its supporters, and the Mormons.

The anger in some quarters of the gay community is palpable. Hopefully, this will translate into a re-energizing within our community that is long overdue. The victories won by the religious right and other gay haters might very well embolden them to seek to further marginalize gay people in this country.

We must fight back. We must demand that politicians take principled stands on our behalf in exchange for our votes. We need to detach our fight for our civil rights from a reliance on politicians from any one political party. It's not too late to turn the tide on those who hate us but we must act on our own behalf. This is no time for complacency. There should be a renewed national gay rights mobilization. We must act now.  


Jim Kelly, Cherry Grove, NY

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by: skeptic49 @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 05:47:39 AM CST

I have to say

that, living in Arkansas and having been married in California last July, yesterday was one of the worst days of my life, right next to the day my mother died.

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by: rhetor1999 @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 06:30:00 AM CST

Hang in there, keep pushing

What an awful blow, and my heart sank when Prop 8 eked out a - well I hate to say victory or win because it doesn't feel like either.  That domino hasn't fallen yet but it is teetering.  Prop 8 was a razor-thin margin and only passed because of massive financial support from bigots.  It's OK now to support marriage rights for everyone - bigotry is slowly going out of style.  Not fast enough, but going.

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by: george.w @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 07:26:21 AM CST

Everything changed: Let's Keep Hope Alive

The GOP is in disarray, the Dems have a new coalition and a leader with the vision and sense of FDR, red states turned blue, America's image is restored, and there's a chance that we can undo the terrible damage of the last 8 years.

CA ain't over till it's over.  There are law suits brewing and I believe the court is prepared to rule Proposition 8 unconstitutional.  But just the same, if they don't, we have to keep fighting.  The country is changing on gay rights--polls show it.  It's slow, too slow, too painful at times like this, but as Teddy Kennedy said in a different context:

the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die.

"In order to maintain an untenable position, you have to be actively ignorant."  The Colbert Report

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by: Lev Raphael @ Thu Nov 06, 2008 at 12:13:49 PM CST