Not Guilty?

Nononono

He is very Gilcup, Your Honor. (misquoting Monty Python)

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by: Louise @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 17:05:16 PM CST

It looks like the first thing he did

after she kicked her shoes out into the hall was to try to knee her in the groin.  He's probably more accustomed to assaulting male prisoners under his control, I guess.

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by: Pollyanna @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 19:05:31 PM CST

if you see the other video...

which is from a camera located in the hallway, you will see that the shoe she kicked off wasn't flung in trajectory that says she was trying to hit him with it. even in the posted video you can see that she was in the process of taking off her other shoe and was caught off guard by the attack--not prepared for retaliation for kicking her shoe at him. Apparently he was seen in a hosp for a bruise on his shin that he claims was from her shoe, but if you look you will see that his shin hit the metal toilet when he slammed her into the wall. So he's a liar and committed an egregious assault on a mouthy teenage girl. this is pathetic and i hope he gets more than a slap on the wrist

"They drew a circle that shut me out Heretic, rebel, a thing to flout. But love and I had the wit to win; We drew a circle that took them in." -Edwin Markham

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by: kara1215 @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 19:16:11 PM CST

actually

he did get hit by her shoe in his shin.  Look at the video at 0:45-0:48 seconds.  It comes out of the holding cell and hits him in his shin.

Most likely this girl was a total smart ass, as is clearly evidenced by her purposely kicking her shoe off at a Law Enforcement Officer, with a huge mouth on her and the guys had finally had enough of her attitude.

Does a grown man need to treat a 15 year old girl in that manner.  Well, no, that seemed very excessive. What I have the biggest problem with in the entire video is his two blows to her head and then dragging her out of the holding cell by her hair.

However, let's not forget a few of the basics here people.  She's not an innocent little child.  She is thug with an attitude, probably a mouth but we don't know that, who committed battery against a Police Officer with her shoe and was under arrest for auto theft. I'm 42 years old and have never seen a holding cell.  She's only 15 and is already committing felonies.

Finally, I am very pro-Cop.  I am from a huge NYPD family and I am a Non-Sworn Volunteer with my local Dept.  One thing I hate more than anything is the one bad Cop that makes the 99.999% of the force look like horrible animals.  The Officer clearly seems to have gone over the edge and it's a shame because then the public looses trust in the Police that are there to protect you.

Besser ein ende mit Schrecken als ein Schrecken ohne ende

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by: becca @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 20:05:59 PM CST

[ Parent ]

The one bad cop?

You must not be familiar with the phrase "another isolated incident."

Not to mention the idea that every cop gets "one free murder."

Oh, and the "blue wall of silence." That phrase right there shouldn't exist.

Maybe it's where I'm from (east Texas), but every cop I've ever met has the biggest ego and entitlement complex I've ever seen. All of them acted like they were above the law (and frequently did break it: speeding, running lights, etc). Many of them made it a past time to harass the local teenagers even when we were doing nothing wrong (wow, a group of A students, none of whom smoked or drank at that time, were at Sonic at 9:30 on a Friday night. Clearly we were doing something wrong).

Things aren't much better where I am now from talking with some people.

Oh yes, also the way cops call non-cops "civilians" as if they weren't paid civilians (which doesn't help with the whole WOD situation and the increasing use of paramlitary tactics to serve drug warrants).

The fact that you even said, "...the guys had finally had enough of her attitude."

There is no excuse for this kind of behavior. NONE. In just about every story I read of police misconduct, it always comes out that these guys had a history of violence. Where are the "good cops" trying to stop this? The only time it ever seems to come up is when someone gets caught.

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by: Bachalon @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 20:48:19 PM CST

[ Parent ]

A Good Cop did do the right thing.

Where are the "good cops" trying to stop this? The only time it ever seems to come up is when someone gets caught.

If it wasn't for the "Good Cops" then these out of control officer would not have gotten in trouble.  It was a Detective in the Police Department that saw the video and immediately did the right thing.

"The tape only surfaced after another sheriff's department detective viewed it and reported it to her superiors."

I guess I didn't express my point correctly enough.  I am not defending this officers actions and I hate it that Cops like him erode the public's trust in the Police.  However, there really are way more good Cops than jerks like this guy.  A Detective in his department did the right thing as would the vast majority of Cops.

I am around Police all the time and they are really wonderful people.  Please don't judge all of them because of jerks like this head case that needs to beat up little girls.

Besser ein ende mit Schrecken als ein Schrecken ohne ende

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by: becca @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 21:02:39 PM CST

[ Parent ]

So one good cop

(that maybe hasn't been implicated in anything yet) is supposed to make up for all the "good cops" that lie to get confessions, that protect bad cops until it's clear they can't any more?

It's supposed to make up for things like this, this, this, this, and this?

No. It doesn't. It never can because we shouldn't have to distinguish between good cops and bad cops. Company one keeps and all that.

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by: Bachalon @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 23:26:37 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Also,

I forgot the nightmare that is Tulia.

I am around Police all the time and they are really wonderful people.

Oh, I'm sure they're nice to you, an ally and supporter, but everyone else? I doubt that.

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by: Bachalon @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 03:42:25 AM CST

[ Parent ]

There's also...

Jean Charles de Menezes, the Brazilian chased into Stockwell Tube Station and executed by London's Metropolitan Police; no-one has faced charges for his murder. US cops are not the only offenders.

____________________________________
Cuius testiculos habes, habeas cardia et cerebellum.

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by: tavdy79 @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 04:46:19 AM CST

[ Parent ]

What about so-called "good cops"

doing nothing?

Where is the chorus of "good cops" condemning no-knock raids that hit the wrong house? Where are the "good cops" coming to apologize and repair damage done?

Oh, right. IT DOESN'T HAPPEN.

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by: Bachalon @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 05:14:21 AM CST

[ Parent ]

i have..

watched the video multiple time and the shoe does not appear to have hit him, it lands between the two officers. And even if it did hit him, she did not fling it hard enough to cause a pocket of blood on his shin. that bruise he got is easily explained by the fact that he hit his leg on the metal toilet during the assault. And regardless if she was calling him every name but the child of God, he had no right to react to her the way he did, that's a 15 year old girl's job---to be mouthy. And it doesn't matter how pro-cop you are, wrong is wrong and he was acting above the law and was clearly in the  wrong because it was very excessive. The fact that she stole a car is irrelevant when she is in a holding cell, no one is saying that she is innocent at all, if she committed the crimes that they said she did then she deserves to be in the holding cell where she is. but he acted like she was trying to run him over with a car and not like she was mouthing off and kicking off her shoe. that's where i have a problem

"They drew a circle that shut me out Heretic, rebel, a thing to flout. But love and I had the wit to win; We drew a circle that took them in." -Edwin Markham

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by: kara1215 @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 21:28:31 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Your post confirms the worst impressions a lot of people have about cops and cop culture.

She not innocent?  No need to wait to prove her guilty, then.  She's not a child?  The age of majority -- which she's three years shy of -- is just a number, after all.

Let's say you're right that she deliberately threw the shoe before the armed man who was twice her size and had her his prisoner beat her to a pulp.  You seem to be making the case that her status as an non-innocent un-child means that was asking for it.  Would raping her have been an understandable response, too?

And we're supposed to believe that he's the "one bad cop" we've been reading about and seeing on the evening news week after week all our lives?  Man, he's been busy.  He really showed those queers at Stonewall what for, too, didn't he?

I, too, am pro-cop, but I think we interpret that in different ways.  I am pro doing the right thing even when it's difficult.  I am pro not having maladjusted, immature sadists on the police force.  I am pro realizing that this is a profession that can attract an element that is just as bad as or worse than the criminals on the street and that they must be constantly weeded out.

I am pro honor, respect, self-restraint, justice and good judgment.  That's why I'm not pro making excuses for a coward with a gun and a badge or saying that an obviously troubled 15 year old gets what she deserves from his tender mercies.  I think she deserves better.  I think we deserve better.  

The only thing that needs to be said is that his violent, irrational, criminal acts were wrong.  Period.  Anything less means we accept a system that isn't good enough for any of us.

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by: diablorobotico @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 23:58:28 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Actually,

the fact that the prisoner is a 14-year-old female is almost irrelevant in judging the appropriateness of the cop's response to the situation.  Ditto, whatever crime she might be charged with.  Ditto, her "attitude" or her "mouth."

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by: Pollyanna @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 03:07:47 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Expected

Most likely this girl was a total smart ass, as is clearly evidenced by her purposely kicking her shoe off at a Law Enforcement Officer, with a huge mouth on her and the guys had finally had enough of her attitude.

Yeah, and what do you say to a woman with two black eyes? Nothing, she's already been told twice.

Unbelievable that you would use this as an excuse to defend what is clearly illegal and entirely inexcusable behavior.

It doesn't matter how mouthy she is, that can't be counted as even a mitigating factor in what he did. That the video didn't come out until weeks after this incident was recorded goes against your later feeble "but there's good guys there, too". If there were good guys there, the man who assaulted a teenager would have been arrested. It's that far over the line of acceptable conduct for an officer.

Cause any fool knows, a dog needs a home; a shelter from pigs on the wing

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by: QueerInSoCal @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 06:26:59 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Oy Vey

Did anyone actually read both of my posts???

Unbelievable that you would use this as an excuse to defend what is clearly illegal and entirely inexcusable behavior.

I never once defended the Cop and in my first post I specifically mentioned him punching her in the head and dragging her around by her hair while cuffed.

I went on further, in both my posts, to say how much I hate Cops like this because they destroy the public's trust in the Police.

Finally, yes, I do support the Police they are my friends and my family and I know that the large majority are good Cops that blow the whistle on bad cops, just like the Detective that blew the whistle on the psycho that beat up that 15 year old girl.  Good Cops like my sister and my father, good Cops like my Brother-In-Law who lost his left leg when the bad guy crushed him in an attempt to kill him.  Of course, when he killed the bad man that tried to kill him and that took his leg before he slipped into unconsciousness there where people out there screaming excessive use of force before he ever regained consciousness. It is things like that that drive me insane.  People hate it when criminals are "tried in the media" but if it's a Cop then he's instantly guilty and they go further into bashing every single Cop in the world.  It's disgusting.  These men and women go out on the streets every day and throw themselves in harms way to protect complete strangers, you.

Once again, I never defended the bad cop in this video but come on people, there is no need to bash every single Cop on the street especially, if you bothered to read the FULL story, you would know that a Detective in his own Dept. is the one that got the tape to her superiors.

Besser ein ende mit Schrecken als ein Schrecken ohne ende

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by: becca @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 08:16:03 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Shall we look at that?

You say you didn't defend him. Why did you start your post with this?

actually he did get hit by her shoe in his shin.  Look at the video at 0:45-0:48 seconds.  It comes out of the holding cell and hits him in his shin.

Most likely this girl was a total smart ass, as is clearly evidenced by her purposely kicking her shoe off at a Law Enforcement Officer, with a huge mouth on her and the guys had finally had enough of her attitude.

There are lots of guys who "finally [get] enough of her attitude". The woman they're fed up with frequently winds up needing medical care, or in the morgue. But, you know, she probably had a huge mouth on her, so she had it coming, at least a little bit. 100% pure, recycled justification.

I don't agree with the people in here who are bending over backwards to paint all cops with the "corrupt power freaks" brush. I know a lot of cops; I've partied with a lot of cops. Hell, I've slept with a couple of cops. But, just as I don't agree with them, I completely reject your immediate apologia, excusing his behavior - and if it wasn't meant to excuse his behavior you wouldn't have started your post with it - and blaming the girl for bringing it on herself.

"She was wearing a mini-skirt that showed her crotch when she leaned over, and a halter top that said "fuck me", but it was a really brutal rape."

"Matthew Shephard tried to seduce McKinney, and he got fed up with it, but it was awful what happened."

Do you see any patterns here?

Cause any fool knows, a dog needs a home; a shelter from pigs on the wing

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by: QueerInSoCal @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 10:42:07 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Thank You

For a lovely, kind and well thought out reply.  Now I get where I was misunderstood in my post when you wrote,

I completely reject your immediate apologia, excusing his behavior - and if it wasn't meant to excuse his behavior you wouldn't have started your post with it

I started with not an apologia but with an analysis of the situation and then went on to say how much I hate him for being a bad Cop.

I started with it because I am a very analytical person and as an Engineer I need to address the issue first and then respond to it.  That was the reason for my starting with what I saw the situation to be after viewing the video and then I went on to describe my feelings about bad Cops.

Thank you for pointing out your perspective because now I see why people where loosing their minds and I couldn't relate.  Sorry everyone, but I did not make my points in importance order, only logical order.

So, are we all friends again?  I hope so, I like it here.
~Becca

Besser ein ende mit Schrecken als ein Schrecken ohne ende

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by: becca @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 20:49:33 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Oh those poor cops

being called names.

One would hope that stronger people would be hired, but these are the same ones that can lie to elicit confessions.

No such thing as a good cop.

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by: Bachalon @ Sun Mar 01, 2009 at 19:55:47 PM CST

I would disagree that there's no such thing as a good cop.

But the way the system works makes it very difficult and sometimes impossible for them to thrive.

For instance, it should be against department regulations for city cops to not live in the city in which they work.  That alone creates a notorious "us vs. them" mentality.  Police forces must be policed by agencies from the outside.  Killer cops must be convicted and it can't be optional for cops to tell the truth about other cops' crimes.

But for all the ways we can change the system, we'll still have all the corruption that will always be there.  That's why we have to be constantly vigilant.  Nobody you don't know who has a gun and authority over you should ever be trusted.  Obeyed when they are legally exercising their authority, yes, but never trusted.

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by: diablorobotico @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 00:18:51 AM CST

[ Parent ]

If it's impossible to be a good person and a cop

then that means exactly what I said: there are no good cops.

There may be good people, but there aren't good cops. The moment someone lies to get evidence or a confession, the second a cop speeds after writing someone a ticket, when they close ranks with someone who obviously commits an inexcusable crime, they are no longer a good cop. How long does it take for that to happen, do you think?

To be a cop, one must be a hypocrite in some form (how many of them smoked drugs in their youth and went on to serve drug warrants how many of them have written tickets for laws they broke themselves).

No good cops.

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by: Bachalon @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 03:45:22 AM CST

[ Parent ]

I'll be sure...

...to tell my next door neighbour that he's the scum of the earth just because he wears a badge.

I'm sure he'll really love it.

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by: acidqueen @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 19:39:18 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Ask him for me

if he's ever lied to get information from a suspect, or if he's ever sped. Ask him how he feels about the war on drugs and his opinions on nicotine, caffeine, and alcohol, too, while you're at it.

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by: Bachalon @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 20:06:09 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Do away

with qualified immunity.

Make them personally liable for mistakes then watch how rapidly things improve.

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by: Bachalon @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 05:17:29 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Sorry, but it makes no difference if the shoe hit the officer

Being disrespected, baited, and assaulted is part of being a police officer. If you respond in kind, assault others, or respond in kind, you need to find another line of work.

Law enforcement officers have to be stoic and have a thick skin. When officers are out of control and use inappropriate or excessive force, they endanger themselves, their fellow officers, and the public. It escalates into what is on this video rather quickly.

The hottest places in hell are reserved for those who, in time of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality. -- John F. Kennedy (inspired by Dante's Inferno)

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by: oldbrit @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 04:52:07 AM CST

This video does not require audio

With the size difference between the cop and the little girl, and the violent way in which he explodes into the room and and attacks the girl, it is very obvious what happened.

She made a comment that threatened his world view and his place in it. She attacked his manliness. I figured she called him gay.

The "Fat Pigs" works only if say the cop's mom regularly abused him with a similar line.

This is moral and immoral. The moral thing, the thing that everyone knows is right inside, though some are afraid to say, is EQUALITY. Inequality is immoral.

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by: mickdansforth @ Mon Mar 02, 2009 at 15:29:35 PM CST